Gospel Regeneration - gospel preaching is a necessary means of regeneration

A mind clogged with dirt prevents clear vision.
Wooliness is the mother of all confusion.

A mind rid of dirt can see clearly.
Distinction is the essence of sound theology!

 

April 16, 2020 

Michael
Dear brother, did you listen to Paul's message?  He does not advocate "decisional" regeneration...or did you miss the part about God opening Lydia's heart?  Sing, you will stand before God and answer for misrepresenting your brothers in Christ.
(Michael G M is an Adjunct Professor of Theology)

Sing
Michael, this is what I wrote: "Decisional evangelism and decisional regeneration are twin daughters of gospel regeneration. Another new school Fullerite, is reviving a new path!"

No, I didn't say Paul Washer advocates decisional regeneration. I did say that "Decisional evangelism and decisional regeneration are twin daughters" of the gospel regenerationists. If you have a problem with my statement, it is your honour to explain the error of that statement.

I believe Paul Washer is a gospel regenerationist just like all the modern new school baptists - they are fullerites. If I misrepresent him, I can repent now. So please prove that I have indeed misrepresent you and your friends.

We both will stand before God side by side...
- you for your crime of misrepresenting those you label as 'hyper-C' as ANTI-mean' while they are not.
- I for my crime of rightly calling you gospel regenerationist, as well as your buddy Paul Washer! <LOL>

Please bear in mind that God opening Lydia's heart to understand the gospel truth IS NOT THE SAME as God regenerating a Lydia dead in trespasses and sins.

REGENERATING someone dead in trespasses and sins and ENLIGHTENING someone already quickened are very different

Before the gospel came to Lydia through Paul, Lydia was ALREADY a woman who feared God, and worship God. READ the passage and see what it says... don't just make it say what you imagined. May be to you, someone still dead in trespasses and sins is able to fear God and worship Him and pray to Him!

Distinction is the essence of sound theology!

Wooliness is the mother of all confusion.

Michael
Mat 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7 Howbeit in ......vain do they worship me,...... teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

Michael
It is possible for a lost man to worship God. It is possible for unregenerate people to go a long way in their experience of God. KJV Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
3 And this will we do, if God permit.
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.
9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.

Verse 9 says that these people were saved....though Paul was writing to them as if they were not. So a person can be baptized, have hands layed on them, ...they can believe in the resurrection and eternal judgment, be enlightened, have tasted the heavenly gift, and in a sense be made a partaker of the Holy Spirit...have a taste for the word of God and the eternal powers...and yet deny Christ...that is ...deny Christ. They were never true believers...they had never experienced regeneration...so a person like Lydia and Cornelius and others can have these desires Before regeneration.

Michael
I think you willfully misunderstand what you term Gospel Regeneration. When a preacher preaches and God uses that in the regeneration of a sinner...it is NOT the word of the preacher that regenerates...it is God's creative word spoken into the heart by the Holy Spirit. Again you mis-characterize...you make red herring...a false condition...clump everyone who disagrees with you into that false position and then try to destroy them as you destroy your false premise. Sing it won't work.

Michael
BTW...did you listen to Paul's message?

Sing
Michael, you mustn't accuse me of wilfully misunderstanding the term gospel regeneration. By gospel regeneration, I mean PRECISELY what you yourself have stated, "When a preacher preaches and God uses that in the regeneration of a sinner...it is NOT the word of the preacher that regenerates...it is God's creative word spoken into the heart by the Holy Spirit."

So, your position is still, WITHOUT the preacher and his preaching, God is without the necessary means to execute his work of regeneration! Without the preacher and his preaching, the Holy Spirit is without the magical means or catalyst to stimulate him to speak God's creative word into the heart!

Don't you see... that the Holy Spirit is dependent upon the means delivered by the preacher for His work of regeneration!

Sing
I have listened to Paul's preaching a few times. Reminds me very much of Al Martin, a popular RB preacher I listened to in the 80s-90s.

Sing
Michael, do remember that Hebrews was written to Jews who are believers in the Lord Jesus Christ, who were tempted to revert to the old covenant worship...

If you don't read and understand Hebrews through that fundamental grid, you are most likely perverting the text.

Sing
Michael @ "They were never true believers...they had never experienced regeneration...so a person like Lydia and Cornelius and others can have these desires before regeneration."
====================

Have you read Romans 3:10ff?
Reread it again slowly. It describes man in his native state of sin and death, i.e. UN-regenerated state!

"A devout man, and one that feared God with all his house, which gave much alms to the people, and prayed to God alway.... Thy prayers and thine alms are come up for a memorial before God... Now therefore are we all here present before God, to hear all things that are commanded thee of God."

And you INSIST that Cornelius was still dead in trespasses and sins DESPITE SUCH PLAIN TESTIMONY.

Your prejudice has blinded you. If Cornelius can give you a few kicks in the butt, may be you will come to your senses!

Michael
I believe what the OLDER Baptist taught about the way faith is begotten...them being passive, dead in sins and trespasses, does believe...Believe what Sing...These OLDER Baptists believed that people believed something unto salvation...it is the gospel which God ordinarily begot by the preaching of the Gospel." I agree with them...you dispute them...to the point that you do not believe that God ordinarily begets people by the preaching of the Gospel. Quit trying to act like you have the high road here when in fact you and the hypers are the later ones.

Michael
As for Hebrews 6, it is true that these are Jewish professors...but what applies to them applies to all...maybe you think we gentiles shouldn't be reading Hebrews...after all..it is for the Hebrews...right?

Sing
Concerning Heb 6, the point to note is that since it was written to Jews who were children of God... those already saved by the free grace of God, the subject matter then is concerning their SPIRITUAL WELL-BEING... it is not about their ETERNAL SALVATION.

The salvation that involves any activity of man CANNOT be the eternal SALVATION that is wholly and solely by the PURE grace of God; it concerns their temporal salvation, i.e their spiritual well-being as God's children, and NOT what they must do IN ORDER to become God's children.

But so many are IGNORANT and OBLIVIOUS of this simple fact, that they apply this to eternal salvation... and so many debate whether God's children can lose their eternal salvation.

Sing
Michael, the grace of faith, as with ALL OTHER saving graces (graces as a product of salvation already bestowed by God's free grace) is worked in the heart by the indwelling Spirit, given to dwell in God's children at adoption.

Preaching draws out the grace of faith already worked in the heart by the Holy Spirit... and the grace of faith manifests itself in the believing act of God's children.

The SALVATION by God's grace that ENABLES believing is DISTINCT from the salvation that God's children will experience from their believing the truth concerning their eternal salvation by God's free grace.

If you CANNOT and REFUSE to distinguish the two distinct salvations, you will remain in CONFUSION. And it seems to you, you willfully choose to remain in confusion. 

"Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" asked the Philippian jailer

Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

April 11, 2012 

The Philippians Jailor - Acts 16
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.

Q1. What does the jailor want to be saved from?

Q2. Is Paul addressing the same salvation that the jailor inquired earnestly?

Q3. How shall the jailor's believing in Christ save him and his house?

Q4. Who is the jailor's house?

Q5. When the jailor asked for a light, who brought it to him - his wife? his daughter? his subordinate?

Q6. Is Paul's reply declaring a salvation by proxy, i.e. the jailor act of believing shall save him AS WELL AS his house?

Q7. What is the salvation that is by proxy here?

If you can keep to the subject, I covet your comments. Thanks.
==========

Comments

Johnny Davis
1. Initially, saved from those above him. Paul turned on the term, "saved" to spiritual salvation.
2. Yes, in the same way that Paul spoke of the idol to the unkown god, being THE God. He had a way of doing that.
3. Yes. For by his belief, his household, of which he was head, also came to believe.
4. Have not studied this. I am assuming his family, though there may be more that one family in residence.
5. No, it is the words of the jailor to the others, the "hearing" that they came to believe, and become baptized ultimately.
6. I've never thought of salvation by proxy, except that Jesus voted for us, on the cross. We did not suffer the agony of death, spiritual and physical, becuase he was our proxy.

Sing F Lau
Thank you for doing better this time... i.e. responding to the specific questions asked.

A1. What do you mean by spiritual salvation? Eternal salvation?

A2. Your answer is gibberish to me.

A3. Apostle Paul said the jailor's believing would save NOT only him but also his house. Explain that... not something else. One man's believing will save him and others... What salvation is the talking about?

A4. I like honest answers... not imaginative ones.

A5. What are the words of the jailor to others? Where does it say in the text? Did he preach a sermon to others?

A6. I suggest there is salvation by proxy... not eternal salvation, but temporal salvation. Haven't you experienced it in life. Someone's act of obedience saves himself and others from certain disasters?

Sing F Lau
I added another question:

Q5. When the jailor asked for a light, who brought it to him - his wife? his daughter? his subordinate?

Johnny Davis
This will be "philosophical," so ignore without considering if you wish, Sing. You ask, what do I mean by physical salvation. All that is physical, man included, is such, only by the creation and will of God. We know what a cell is. We know laws of physics. We know that nothing in the physical remains without change, and physical life, though a mystery, is merely physical things, arranged to be able to move and think (in the case of humans). Everything physical passes. It all changes. It is never the same. It all eventually dies. The jailer was worried about his physical life, when he asked Paul, something like this: "How can you help ME (breathing, thinking physical ME) get out of being killed for allowing you to escape. I've got a family that needs me." Those folks spoke common language, and not the churchy lingo of the KJV, in all likelihood. Paul, very diplomatic and shrewd (real Philemon for a great example of this), seized the opportunity to teach, so that the jailor could hear, and believe (actually, he already "believed" having the receptiive heart of godliness), to tell the gospel of Jesus, which resulted in spiritual life forever with God, and the jailor told the same story to his family and household (servants, perhaps), and they too believed, resulting in eternal life. Now, how long the physical salvation from the Roman higher-ups lasted, we don't know. I'd bet the jailer gave a shot at speaking the gospel, before he was punished. Yet, we do know, all his family and household were ultimately saved (and baptized), and I look forward to meeting them, in whatever condition or reality God chooses for his sons and daughters to be.

Johnny Davis
As to the "light," let me read the scripture. Don't recall and have not thought of that one.

Charles Page
interesting, Sing, Paul referenced proxy baptism for the dead, salvation for the unbelieving spouse.

I am inclined to think that salvation that is referenced here in Acts 16 (10 as well) is not conceived in westernized individualistic terms but family/group units. Belonging is probably more central than believing.

Just thinking out loud by way of weird opinions!!!

Johnny Davis
Good thought, Charles, and in the culture of that day, the household probably went along with the man or head of the house, in everything. I suspect, though, that was done, in the Jewish culture, not out of fear, though that element may have been present. The hearts of the household would have to be receptive to God, for their conversion to have meaning, regardless if baptized or not, for example. As they were "saved" then that must have been their situation, not "obeying" the head, as the Muslim culture now requires, but from love.

Sing F Lau
Charles, when did you imbibe mormonistic idea of baptism for the dead?

Take a look here:
http://letgodbetrue.com/questions/baptism-for-dead.htm.
What is the Baptism for the Dead?

Sing F Lau
Hey look, I am an easterner. I think as an easterner, and reason as an easterner. So, where is the neutral zone we can talk some sense?

Charles Page
Didn't say i believe it...but that Paul referenced it in I Cor. I am not fully convinced that the parents cannot bring an infant to the pastor for baptism and not just dedication. There still seems to be an argument for proxy parenting for children.

We westerners are wierd! I know ...but my eternal salvation secured in heaven makes me feel free to think out of the box without fear of what men may think. I certainly would not be acting like a crazy man carrying signs in front of an institution that will never heed my call to repent.

Sing F Lau
I surely like that statement: "but my eternal salvation secured in heaven makes me feel free to think out of the box without fear of what men may think." I feel very liberated too... which is why I am learning precious truth because I dare question the great 'reformers'!

I believe there is salvation by proxy... in the temporal salvation. Believing parents save their children from the many evils that pervade the degenerating society now.

Charles Page
...but, it gets me in soooo much trouble! God wants our minds blazing and not just smouldering!

Johnny Davis
What about priests, and last rites (to "cover" sins not prayed for)? The scripture on "the dead" baptism, etc. was what? Need to study that.

Sing F Lau
I need no priest. Me myself and I am a member of the royal priesthood, with Christ alone as my High Priest.

If I hadn't believed in baptism for the dead, I would never have been baptized... it was because I was already dead in Christ, I submitted to baptism.

Baptism is for those who know they are dead in Christ!

Charles Page
My guess is that baptism for the dead was for those whose acquaintances had passed and though they had eternal salvation they had not lived up to temporal salvation and it was a possible measure to pray for their lives in hades they knew about and knew they were in need of desperate measures. If you participate in funerals you know there are people whose lives were not prepared for death. Arminians lose all hope that they are in the "lake of fire" but Bible-believing people know about eternal salvation and do not lose all hope but trust in a just God who does show wrath to ungodly regenerates.

Perhaps they are pleading for mercy. We have lost this today due to the Arminian heresies that are dominant today! 

Preach the word: some implication for the hearers

Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season...

2 Timothy

4:1 ¶ I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

The solemn implications for Timothy's flock:

Implication 1
4:1 ¶ I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2. Hear the word; be instant in season, out of season; receive reproof, rebuke, exhortation with patience and sound mind!!!

Implication 2
The congregation has the divine right to demand that the word of God be preached from the pulpit! They have the divine right to insist that nothing but the word of God be preached to them.

Implication 3
The congregation is under solemn obligation to remove from the pulpit men who do not, and would not preach the word of God, but something else!

Adam
Very good implications!

It would seem to me that if the congregation was adamant about the word of God, it would be very difficult for a man to speak otherwise. Men preach something else, because that is what the people want to hear.

Charles
Nehemiah 8:4

Sing
Last evening, in our weekly Bible study, we went through Neh 8.

"And all the people gathered themselves together as one man into the street that was before the water gate; and they spake unto Ezra the scribe to bring the book of the law of Moses, which the LORD had commanded to Israel."

"... And they spake unto Ezra the scribe TO BRING OUT the book of the law of Moses..."

How I wish people will stand up and demand... "Preach from the Bible, the word of God."

Manuel R Briva
Pulpits nowadays are filled with manpleasing messages, unnecessary quotes, annecdotes from reformers , quotes from confessions of faith & masterful seminary trained patterned preaching except the pure Gospel. Thank God it's not so with the Old Baptists! God be merciful for not leaving us in darkness.

The time of the Death and Resurrection of Christ

 

April 10, 2020  ·

Just one question related to the time of the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

The first 24-hour day of the Jewish week consists of the 12-hr evening (6pm-6am) and 12-hr morning (6am-6pm); i.e. evening (Sat 6pm-Sun 6am) and morning (Sun 6am-Sun 6pm).

Genesis 1:5 KJV
And God called the light Day, the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
============

Comments

Dhong
I think it will depend on what day you place the death of Christ. If it is on Wednesday then it would be after 6pm of Saturday.

If you place the death of Christ on Thursday then it would be after 6am on the first day of the week or Sunday.

Sing
Dhong, which day do you put the day of Christ's death, and why?

Dhong
Sing: Taking into consideration the 3days and 3nights, It will be Wednesday. And when the women went into the grave it was yet dark and when they arrived the angel declared that Christ was already risen.
[sing: It was yet dark because they came very early on Sunday morning, before dawn!]

Reggie
Dhong: don’t let the sabbath throw u off. A high holy day is also a sabbath. So, you can have 2 sabbaths in a row. Crucified on a Thursday gives you three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.. placing a risen Savior on Sunday Morning. But, I think Sing’s question has an element to it, how early was the resurrection? Sunday morning is actually our Monday morning at 5-6am.

Dhong
Reggie: If Jewish time reckoning is sundown to sunrise is 👉 night , then sunrise to sundown 👉day then the resurrection would have taken place after sunrise to complete the 3days and 3nights factor of Christ resurrection prophecy.

Sing
Reggie Lee @ "...Sunday morning is actually our Monday morning at 5-6am.'
-------
What do you mean??????????????????????????????????????????

Dhong
Sing: What's your stand on this matter? On what day do you place Christ's death on the cross?

Sing
My stand is the soapbox!
Christ died around Thur 3pm; He was buried shortly.

Reggie,
Sing hey, I went 24 hours too far... I’m trying to put Mary at the tomb before sunrise. And the Jewish days go from 6 am to 6 am..

Philip
Reggie: Jewish days go from 6pm to 6pm. Evening starts the day!

Dellis
Doesn't the High day, mentioned in John 19, have a significance ?

Sing
High day is the Annual Sabbath, distinct from the weekly Sabbath.

Dellis
Sing: But does it have to fall on a Saturday?

Sing
I don't know. From the Scriptures, the day after the crucifixion is the High Day (an annual sabbath) followed by the weekly Sabbath.

Dellis
Sing, agreed.
Christ arose on the first day of the week

[sing: first day of the week is Sun6am-6pm; first night of the week is Sat6m-Sun6am. A 24hr Jewish day is 12hr night and 12hr day, from 6pm to 6pm.]

Reggie
Dellis: No

Sing
Read Mt 28... pay attention to those elite Romans Marines posted to guard the tomb - to ensure that the dead remain in the tomb, and not stolen, to discredit Christ's claim - and their fleeing from the tomb to the city to report what they had witnessed.

What time did they flee from the tomb and rushed to the city?

I take it as an incontrovertible fact that the resurrection of Christ was marked by an earthquake, just as His death was similarly marked by an earthquake. Mt 27:50-54.

If any disagree, tell us why.

Dhong
Sing: The earthquake signified that Christ has resurrected from the dead and when the women came to the tomb it was early in the morning of the first day of the week. Suffice it to say that there was 3days and 3nights and Christ resurrected as prophesied in the holy writ.

[sing: First day of the week begins at Sunday 6am; first night of the week begins at Sat 6pm]

Sing
Dhong, so which day was Christ put to death?

Dhong
Sing: John 19:31 "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away."

[sing: The Passover day was followed by the annual sabbath day (an high day); then the weekly sabbath.]

Buddy
The Scriptures tell us that " as Jonah was 3 days and and 3 nights in the whales' belly so shall the Son of man be." One natural day is 24 hrs. It's constant wherever you are. Therefore 3 days and 3 nights is 72 hrs. Based on Jewish calendar, Christ died 3pm Wed and resurrected 3pm Saturday. And on Sun., He was already alive! You need not be a mathematician to compute that, just count the rotation of the clock. To check, reverse the counting. If your resurrection is Sun., so what time? The Bible says early dawn nearing the first day of the week (Sun.), Jesus Christ was already alive! HE IS ALIVE TODAY AND FOREVER.!!!

Sing
Salvator, I like your mathematically precise approach that 3d3n MUST BE exactly 72hrs, no more no less. I don't know if that is ever the way language is commonly used then or even today. To me it is an idea arbitrarily imposed upon the Scriptures out of thin air.

Just one difficulty: the 3d3n=72hr notion would mean the chief priests and the Pharisees, the contemporaries, ALSO couldn't count. Perhaps. And they requested the elite guards to be posted for the night, the first evening of the Jewish week, between Sat 6pm- Sun 6am.

Mt 27
62¶Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate,
63Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.
64Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.

[Salvador deleted his comments!]

Buddy
Sing For clarification In Matt.27:62 that you presented "the next day" there, what day was that"?

Sing
Did Christ say 3days and 3 nights or did He say 3 night and 3 days?
Would the former mean rising after the 3rd night; the latter, rising after the 3rd day?
What do you think?

Buddy
Sing: I think all people (including the Pharisees, et al) wherever they are, understand what 3 days and 3 nights mean. It is 3 natural (whole) days, which is equavalent to 72 hrs. If night time here, other areas are daytime. Still the time reckoning is the same, 24 hrs in one whole day. Jonah 1:17 and Matt.12: 38-40 tell us " 3days and 3nights". In the creation account of days, it is repeatedly mentioned "the evening and the morning" as one day - Gen.1: 5,8,13,19,23,31.

Christ said in John 11:9 - "Are there not 12 hrs in a day?" - meaning daytime. In the four gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John presented this subjects about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ in varied circumstances but they are not contradictory, they compliment each other. There are impt. events to consider that transpired prior to the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, that lead me to come up with the said prior presentation.

Would you mind to pls. present your view of what day and time did Christ die?

Sing
Salvador, I don't begin with the premise that the usage of 3 days and 3 nights in common usage requires a 3 full 12hr-day and 3 full 12hr-night, though that is mathematically precise.

At least the chief priests and the Pharisees didn't have such a notion. If they had, they wouldn't have posted the Romans guards after the resurrection had occurred.

They did take Christ's claim seriously; they certainly could count; they, being contemporaries, were certainly in a better position to understand the numbers involved.

That's my view about the 3d3n phrase.

PJ Walters
There was a saying among the Jews that part of a day is considered a day.

Buddy
Sing The Scriptures is clear from Jonah 1:17 and Matt.12:38-40 "3days and 3nights". God is not the author of confusion and I stand to what I presented. For the sake of argument, setting aside mathematics. Just using common sense by comparing and making 2 circles by putting nos. of Jewish time reckoning and Roman (Gentile) time frame. The former is 6 to 6 and the latter 12 to 12. Using the KJV of the Bible, we read various events that transpired prior to the death, burial and resurrection of Christ - Matt.27 and other Gospels.

Crucifixion - Mark 15:25 -third hour (9am Gentile time).

Total darkness - Mark 15:33 - sixth hour til ninth hour - (12 Nn til 3pm Gentile time). Pls refer to Matt. 27 regarding these events. Matt. 27:46-50 - about the ninth hour (3pm Gentile time) He expired.

Resurrection - Matt.28:1-6; Mark 16:1-2.

Now, Christ died 3pm as the Scriptures present. We are told that "as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week" ; "very early in the morning the first day of the week", Christ was already alive!

Again, let us go back to the "3days and 3nights". Christ died the "ninth hour" (3pm Gentile time, Sat.) If we compare the 2 circles made and reverse the rotation regarding the 3d and 3n, we can get precisely the 3pm Wed time. That is my common sense of presentation. Others claim a Fri. death scenario and that fall very short of time reckoning. May I know what you think, bro. Lau?

Sing
Thanks Brother. I have no issue with the 3d3n phrase; I do when that is equated as 3 12hr days and 3 12hr night, 72hrs and no less.

Also the hours around the Sunday dawn are within the time frame of "very early in the morning the first day of the week." [First day of the week begins at Sun 6am; first night of the week begins at Sat 6pm]

The first day of the week starts at 6am Sunday. The first one or two hours of the first day of the week are within the "very early in the morning the first of the week."

Also, the hours around the Sunday dawn are within the time frame of "very early in the morning the first day of the week." early in the morning the first of the week."

Buddy
Sing: Agreed and welcome bro. Lau. 

Dellis
Mark 9:31 For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.

1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

I take this to mean He rose again on the third day not after the third day

Christ was taken down at the end of Thursday and He lay Fri. Sat. and rose on Sunday. the third day.

Reggie
See, that’s where I got that idea of mixing our thinking with biblical time... it actually put me Monday morning at 530 to 6 am...

Sing
Matthew 27:64 KJV — Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.
*until the third day*

Sing
Luke 24:21 KJV — "But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the third day since these things were done."
*to day is the third day since these things were done*

- what day were those words spoken?
- what day were those things done?

Henry 
The women went early before signup he was already risen! Wir

Sing
While they were on the way, the resurrection took place, marked by that thunderous earthquake of rejoicing.

PJ Walters
To me what makes sense is a Thursday crucifixion since the Jews of that time understood part of day as a day.

Thursday: crucifixion and burial before sundown. Day 1.
Thursday night: lying in the tomb. Night 1.
Friday: lying in the tomb. Day 2.
Friday night: lying in the tomb. Night 2.
Saturday: lying in the tomb. Day 3.
Saturday night: lying in the tomb and resurrecting before sunrise. Night 3.

Noteworthy to mention: Friday was a high sabbath, so anointing a body during that time would not be permitted. Saturday was the weekly sabbath, so no anointing was permitted then, either. This tells us that no disciples would have been visiting the tomb friday or Saturday, so there was no chance of them stealing the body.

The women would have set out as early as they could before sunrise since the first day of the week would have been their earliest opportunity to anoint his body, but they didn't get to the tomb until a little after dawn.

Concerning the disciples on the road to Emmaus, Saturday night would have been the beginning of the 1st day of the week, so it would have been "the third day since these things were done."

Sing
PJ Walters, That makes lots of sense.

"Let us go on unto perfection..."

"Therefore leaving the principles of
the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection..."
Hebrews 6:1a 

April 10, 2023

"Let us go on unto perfection*..."

1. Stuck, not going on...

Hebrews 5
12 ¶For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Note: we can be stuck in so many ways; stuck in erroneous teaching, in traditions, etc.

2. Call to Go On unto Maturity
Hebrews 6:1a "Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection..."

a. Who are called to go on unto perfection?
- those who were once enlightened,
- those who have tasted of the heavenly gift,
- those who were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
- those who have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come.  (Hebrews 6:4-5.)

Some of these, according to their works, receive blessing: others, according to their works too, are nigh unto cursing, whose temporal end is to be burned.

The solemn truth is illustrated thus...

3. Two Responses and their Consequences

Hebrews 6
7 ¶For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Verse 7-8 speak of those mentioned in verse 4-5, those who have been so blessed.

*perfection: maturity.