Calvinism, the PBs, the RBs, etc

3/24/25, 1:36 PM
Fidelis
How are you, Bro Sing? It's been a long time

sing
I'm doing fine. The Lord keeps and upholds me. 

Fidelis
As I understand it, you're no longer upholding the Reformed faith!

sing
If you can tell me what the Reformed faith is, I may be able to ascertain whether your understanding is right or not.
How do you come to that understanding?
Thanks for your concern.

Fidelis
Well, Reformed Faith is Calvinism, isn't it?

sing
What is Calvinism?
- Is it the version Calvin taught?
- Is it the version John Gill taught?
- Is it the version Andrew Fuller taught?
Or what do the Scriptures teach?

Sincere questions.

See this article on Calvin's commentary on John 3:16

https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2011/12/john-calvins-notions-on-john-316.html

Fidelis
Here is my personal view in John 3.16

John 3:16, A Problem Text

In Greek, "cosmos" means "the world," but it specifically refers to the world of people, encompassing society, civilization, and the political powers and divisions of that world. This definition is reflected in the English word "cosmopolitan," which combines "kosmos" with "polis," the Greek word for "city." In this context, the world in John 3:16 appears to be limited in scope.

The logical reasoning to refute this view relies on the doctrinal system of the Doctrine of Grace and other Bible versions and translations derived from old manuscripts. The world in that passage refers to the world of the elect, comprising both Jews and Gentiles. Christ prayed for the elect from among both groups (John 17:2, 9, 12; Ephesians 2:12, 19-22). Therefore, the world in this context is limited in scope.

The word "world" has various uses, such as the world of politics, sports, show business, and science. In Luke 2:1, Augustus Caesar decreed that the world should pay taxes. However, this did not mean the entire world, but rather the known world at that time. Similarly, when the Pharisees said that the whole world was following Christ (John 12:19), this was an exaggeration.

In the science of biblical interpretation, or hermeneutics, such exaggerations are recognized as literary devices. The words "world" and "whosoever" in John 3:16 have been translated in a way that creates a problem text. The word "whosoever" emphasizes human will in eternal salvation, making it conditional rather than unconditional.

According to some Bible scholars who have investigated old manuscripts, the word "whosoever" is not found in the original text. The earliest English translations of the Bible, such as John Wycliffe's Bible (1385) and William Tyndale's Bible, did not include the word "whosoever" in John 3:16.

Here are some translations of John 3:16:

- John Wycliffe Bible (1385): "For God louede so the world, that he yaf his oon bigetun sone, that ech man that bileueth in him perische not, but haue euerlastynge lijf."

- William Tyndale Bible: "For God so loveth the worlde yt he hath geven his only sonne that none that beleve in him shuld perisshe: but shuld have everlastinge lyfe."

- Literal American English translation: "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, each one believing or every one that believing should not perish have everlasting life."

- Concordant Literal New Testament: "EVERY ONE WHO IS BELIEVING."

- Young's Literal Translation: "For God so love the world, that His Son - the only begotten – he gave, THAT EVERYONE WHO IS BELIEVING in him may not perish, but may have life age during."

- New Living Translation: "So that EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES in him."

The word "whosoever" implies conditional salvation and emphasizes human will. However, the original text and early translations do not support this interpretation.

If we accept that John 3:16 refers to general atonement, meaning Christ died for all without exception or distinction, then we must ask why many people will still go to hell. If Christ's death is powerful, then why do we need to exercise our will or make a decision to determine our own destiny? Christ did not die if our decision would save us from the power of sin. Then what is the essence of Christ's death if our decision or will would save us?

The Scripture is clear that Christ did not die for the whole world, but only for a particular people, the elect, who were chosen before the world began (Matthew 1:21; Ephesians 1:4; Acts 13:48).

3/25/25, 12:50 PM

sing
You are scholarly.
To me, it's simple.

The world, not just the Jews, but people from "all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues."

Revelation 7:9 KJV — After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands.

I'm simple.

3/26/25, 6:21 PM
Fidelis
So if that is your definition of "world", it means Christ died for all without exception, am I correct?

Isn't that in that passage that you quoted  from Revelation implying all saved from different nations, from different tongues, from different races, from different colors of skins, are they refering as elect and saved?

But not the whole humankind

sing
God elected a people OUT OF "all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues" and gave them to Christ to redeem; Christ came to save the same exact people, not one more and not one less.

John 6:39 KJT — And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

John 17:2 KJT — As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Revelation 5:9 KJV — And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation.

God's elect are found in every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation.

Which part you don't understand, just ask.

4/4/25, 1:05 PM
Fidelis
Bro Sing, since your soteriology is the same as Primitive Baptists, why not join the PBs

sing
I'm a heretic to them! 😃😃😃

Fidelis
Why?

sing
I don't believe in the eternal sonship; I believe in the incarnational Sonship.
Jesus is DIVINELY begotten; Jesus is not eternally begotten.

Fidelis
If he was divinely begotten, what was his first existence within the Godhead?

sing
Take a look here: Jesus Christ - Eternally Begotten or Divinely Begotten?
https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2025/02/jesus-christ-eternally-begotten-or.html.

Any questions? Ask further.

sing
Take a look here: Man, the Begotten Jesus, and the Divine Word
https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2013/12/man-begotten-jesus-and-divine-word.html

John 1
1 ¶In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...
14 ¶And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Fidelis
I can't view several times  I click it
Maybe you can summarise your explanation.

sing
It's simple to me.
That which is eternal CANNOT be begotten.
That which is begotten CANNOT be eternal.
UNLESS theologians twist and pervert the simple word "begotten".

That which is eternal can be made flesh, i.e. incarnated.

Fidelis
How can you reconcile it in the context of Trinity and in the doctrine of Kenosis?

sing
Nothing to reconcile; incarnational Sonship happened when the eternal Word, the Second Person of the Trinity, was made flesh.

Go to the blog and search "divinely begotten..."
https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/

Fidelis
good day  I am about to leave from work going home

4/4/25, 6:49 PM
sing
Here are the long exchanges with the Primitive Baptists on the subject.
https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2011/11/confession-of-faith-predestination.html

Scroll about 1/3 down... starting here:

Here is one example:
1689.2.3 '..... the Son is ETERNALLY begotten...' I repudiate this as erroneous.

The Son Jesus is DIVINELY begotten, has a beginning.

The Word is eternal and unbegotten; has no beginning.

4/20/25, 3:31 PM

Fidelis
Thanks.

4/30/25, 12:04 PM

Fidelis
How do you explain John 1.18?

sing
It's like you're saying, "My wife went to that playschool."

Fidelis
Does my question so childish?
Or is it just like an elementary question?

4/30/25, 1:03 PM
sing
You misunderstood; the word of truth is too solemn to be handled lightly or frivolously.
After she is married to you, whatever she did before she was married to you is spoken of as done by your wife, in her new standing.

After the eternal Word was made flesh, i.e. after incarnation, whatever was done by the Word BEFORE the incarnation is spoken of as done by the Son, the Word made flesh.

Another example:

Hebrews 1
1¶God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds.

But understand this in light of John 1
1 ¶In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made...
14 ¶And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

These truths are so elementary and obvious to unprejudiced minds.

Jan 17, 2026, 12:29 PM
Fidelis
Ho bro Sing, how are you?

sing
Fine and still breathing.
Yourself?

Jan 17, 2026, 1:02 PM
Fidelis
Same, still alive and kicking
Do you agree with Reformed Covenant Theology?

sing
It's such a big term.
What are its main components?

Fidelis
The whole system, including the discontinuity of the Baptist view on Baptism
And also the replacement theology

Feb 15, 2026, 7:03 PM
Fidelis
Hi Bro Sing
How are you, sir?

When you were still in Reformed Baptist, did you receive an invitation to the ReBap Conference here in the Philippines?

Feb 15, 2026, 8:17 PM
I heard of the Conference organized by Brian Ellis.
(He was a guest in my home in Penang when he attended a Reformed Ministers Conference in Malaysia)

sing
No, I don't remember any invitation. The RB churches here were basically under the "control" of one man... XYZ.

However, both Brian Ellis and Noel Espinoza were invited by XYZ to attend his Reformed Ministers Conference in Malaysia. Brian even stayed with us after the conference.

Why do you ask?

Feb 15, 2026, 8:40 PM
Fidelis
They have a regular annual pastors' conference every 1st week of February. I was thinking that you were once a guest speaker.

sing
What a joke!
I was in General Santos City once, on a fact-finding trip...
I was a nobody among the RBs. Why would I be invited as a speaker? 🤣🤣🤣.

Now I am famous/notorious among the RBs as a heretic!

 

Self-learning is better than spoon-feeding

 

#lostinAdam

#blessedinChrist

A man quoted John Calvin as saying, as in the screenshot above:

"We have in Christ what we have lost in Adam."

me: What we are given and have in Christ are INFINITELY more than what we lost in Adam.

him: Explain.

me: What did you lose in Adam?

What were you blessed with in Christ?

him: You answered my question with a question.

(Did you ask a question? What is your question? sing)

me: The answers to the questions in response to your request for explanation shall provide the obvious explanation.

Self-learning is better than spoon-feeding.

--------------

p/s

If you don't know that what you have in Christ is infinitely more than what you lost in Adam, it's an indication that you have not adequately apprehended the fullness of the gospel of Christ.

"Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD..."

#Reason

The gospel administered to the spiritually dead has the same effect as administering food to the physically dead.

Matthew 7:6
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Acts 17:2
And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,

Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

Acts 18:19
And he came to Ephesus, and left them there: but he himself entered into the synagogue, and reasoned with the Jews.

Isaiah 1:18
"Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD..."

Sola Fidei is a Devil's Lie, and so many love it!

"The just shall live by faith..." 
is a declaration of fact about the just, i.e. they shall live by faith;
IT IS NOT a prescription for how the condemned can be justified by God.
THIS is ELEMENTARY. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/notes/10217726097279662

Sola Fidei is a Devil's Lie, and so many love it!

Sola fidei, the 16th century reformation doctrine - 'faith alone in Christ' for one's justification before God - is a great LIE introduced by the devil to corrupt the mind of God's children.

My LEGAL condemnation took place in the garden of Eden.

My LEGAL justification took place on the cross.

If my legal justification hadn't taken place at the cross... I am undone. Will Christ die one more time to take away my sins? That great double imputation took place at the cross - ALL my sins were legally imputed to Christ, and Christ's perfect righteousness was LEGALLY imputed to me.

Those who reject that their LEGAL justification took place at the cross... i.e. that their sins were not imputed to Christ and He died in the place as a legal substitute... when do they hope to have their sins taken away? That Christ would die one more time for them??? They have just missed the ONLY occasion ordained of God for the taking away of sins... foolish.

Deceived people insist that their LEGAL justification takes place at their believing in Jesus Christ! They think those still under the state of condemnation is capable of believing to have their condemnation removed, i.e. justified by God! And they still foam at the mouth that it is by free grace!

My legal condemnation was applied and becomes PERSONAL at my conception... being conceived and born in sin.

My legal justification was applied and becomes PERSONAL at my regeneration... being called out of my native state of sin and condemnation.

A sinner's personal condemnation IS -IS - IS EXPERIENCED through his acts of sins and unrighteousness, which MANIFEST his native state of condemnation.

My personal justification IS -IS - IS EXPERIENCED through my act of believing in Christ Jesus, which EVIDENCES my state of justification by God's free grace.

---------

Kindly peruse these short articles on the same subject:

https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2011/04/what-meaneth-this-reformed-shibboleth.html

https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2011/05/three-distinct-sets-of-contrast-in.html

https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2011/05/three-distinct-sets-of-contrast-in.html

https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2008/01/by-faith-alone-vs-not-by-faith-alone.html

 

Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith

 

"Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"

The Apostle Paul is addressing BRETHREN and SAINTS...

And these Corinthian BRETHREN and SAINTS were behaving very unbecomingly - having been misguided and deceived by some 'super apostles' and were disaffected towards Apostle Paul, and were doubting his office and his gospel.

These BRETHREN and SAINTS were acting unbecoming of the gospel - that Apostle Paul asked them to examine themselves, whether they be IN THE FAITH.

God's children may behave and conduct themselves in such a way that they are NOT in the faith!

Their STATUS as BRETHREN and SAINTS is not being questioned! Their unbecoming conduct and spirit are... they are reprobates in their conduct and spirit towards Apostle Paul.

But so many take this passage as Apostle Paul's admonishing the Corinthians to examine whether they are reprobates in the context of divine election to eternal life!!!

[Someone asked a question... but has deleted it, and his other comments]

Sing F Lau
Quite simple sir...
Make the distinction between being in the STATE OF GRACE, and being IN THE FAITH.

God's children, who are already in THE STATE OF GRACE, need to be brought INTO the faith first through the gospel ministry... and by their obedience STAYS and REMAINS in the faith. Their carelessness and disobedience will reverse that. Unbelief, and God's children are so capable of that, cause them to cease to be IN THE FAITH. BUT nothing will cause them to cease to be in the STATE OF GRACE - for that is wholly, solely, completely by the grace of God, and it is immutable and eternal!

You know, so many American citizens are disgustingly un-American! The same happens among God's children, and this explains the need for the question, "whether ye be IN the faith?"

Jerry Chapin
If we could just remember that the Scriptures were written for the Lord's children and not for the unregenerate perhaps our thinking would tend to fall into place.

Sing F Lau
MC @ A man may profess faith and not be in a state of Grace.
However, I see the terms "in Christ", "in the Faith" as describing the same kind of people.

================

There is probably confusion in both statements.

A man is effectually called into a state of grace and salvation is UNITED to Christ, therefore is in Christ. There is nothing a man can do bring himself to be in the state of grace or to be in Christ. That is entirely divine work. Only when God HAS effectually calls an elect and unites him to Christ ENABLES a man to do something to be IN THE FAITH.

A man is in Christ by the free and sovereign work of God. And this work is complete and immutable.

A man is in the faith through the gospel ministry by his believing and obedience to the gospel. He does something right to be in the faith. He does something wrong, and he is NOT in the faith.

Apostle Paul, who called the Corinthians to examine themselves whether they be in the faith, said these words to the same people: " Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you."

There are not just religious niceties. They are inspired truth. There are BRETHREN, children of God.

A child of God may not be in the faith by their unbelief and unbecoming conduct.

Sing F Lau
MC @ "But I have prayed for thee that thy FAITH FAIL NOT." Luke 22:32
========

Apostle Peter's faith did fail... and if Christ had not prayed for the recovery of his faith, he would have become a castaway concerning his faith. Those are historical facts.

Why pray against something from happening if there is no possibility of that ever happening?

Similarly, why warn against something happening if there is no possibly of that danger to actually happening?

It is quite simple to my simple mind.

It takes me NOTHING to be in the STATE OF GRACE. It is all by the free and sovereign grace of God. And there is nothing I can un-do what God has done for me. I am not involved in doing it, and I won't be involved in its un-doing.

It takes me, a child of God by His free and sovereign grace, a great deal to come into the faith, and remain in the faith. It is by my ACTIVE RESPONSES to God's will to enter into the faith, and to remain in the faith. By my carelessness and negligent, I may just undo that.

The Corinthians were already in the STATE OF GRACE before Apostle Paul's faithful ministry brought them into the faith of the gospel. Then some 'super apostles' came to the church in Corinth and preached another Jesus and another gospel as well as caricatured Apostle Paul and his gospel. Through this, the SAINTS and BRETHREN in Corinth were deceived and misled... prompting Apostle Paul to exhort them to examine whether they are STILL in the faith. They give all appearance they they are NO LONGER because of their doubt against Paul's apostleship and his gospel.

"One who is "in Grace" can NEVER "cease to be in the faith" - this is fiction at best; at worst, it is clearly anti-scriptural.

Just being honest. Keep talking

Sing F Lau
Please say hello to Elder Hulan Bass.
He is too enigmatic for too many people.
Very few understand pb jargons! <LOL>

Sing F Lau
I read that Peter denied Christ, with swearing and cursing...
He forsook Christ and went back to his life...

UNTIL Christ restored him.

There were many like Peter was not restored... but made a complete shipwreck of their faith.

Sing F Lau
"ALL MEN have not faith..."
Very many believe "ALL MEN" included those dead in trespasses and sins, who obviously have not faith... but that is a foolish idea. It makes Paul to say something so obvious, and also as though he expects faith from such.

'ALL MEN" obviously refers specifically to the children of God, and NOT all of them are believing. This is a hard saying. It is so much easier to say the unbelieving are dead in trespasses and sins.

"As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sake: but as touching ELECTION, they are beloved for the father's sake."

How many Christians there are today who are unbelieving concerning THE GOSPEL once delivered to the saints.

Sing F Lau
 @ "One who is "in Grace" can NEVER "cease to be in the faith" - If this notion is true, then all those warnings to the BRETHREN and SAINTS (those brought into the state of grace by God's free grace are meaningless and redundant.

Or may be the apostles who issued those warnings didn't know such modern notions. Otherwise, the warnings sound foolish and redundant!

Warnings against the real danger of falling from the faith are very different from exhortations to continue walking in the faith.

The former presuppose the real danger of God's children falling away. To say otherwise is to make the warnings redundant and foolish, and to turn them into lies.

The latter presuppose that the real danger can be avoided with watchfulness and diligence.

Both are the teaching of Scriptures. You choose to believe the latter. That's your liberty!

And there are plian facts that some of God's children have made shipwreck of their faith... some would rather judge that such do not have faith to begin with because of the presupposition that God's children cannot make a shipwreck of their faith.

Sing F Lau
Think through such rhetorical questions... they arise out of confusion.

Those passages are consistent with the truth that every child of God is kept and preserved in the state of grace.

The state of grace is a direct result of regeneration. Regeneration brings an elect into the state of grace. Regeneration is solely the divine act... remotely connected with the perseverance of those regenerated!

The SOUND of "our faith" has distracted you... you miss its SENSE. "Our FAITH" is that faith of the elect given to each one at effectual calling. It is "our FAITH" in the sense that it belongs to us, our possession.

It is our FAITH NOT in the sense that we persevere in a life of believing and obeying.

You insist on the latter; you get the SOUND but miss the SENSE.

Your being in the state of grace is kept by the power of God... not your act of persevering in believing and obeying to the end of your life.

Your false presupposition causes you to reject what is plainly stated in the Scriptures. God's children do suffer destruction in this life... they make a shipwreck of their faith... they fall out of the faith because of negligence and carelessness.

I have said enough. I will let you have the last word.

I will archive the exchanges and leave it on the blog for my church members to read. You will appear as "Catte".

Thank you for the discussion.