"EVEN SO" - Pay close attention to these little words.

#evenso

Pay attention, close attention, to little words.

Romans 5:18 - KJT
"Therefore as
by the offence of one
judgment came upon all men to condemnation;
EVEN SO
by the righteousness of one
the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life." 

If sincere folks and their intelligent theologians had paid attention to those two small words 'EVEN SO' they wouldn't have ended up believing the fiction or fable of their legal justification by their faith!

Your legal condemnation was brought about by the act of your divinely appointed representative head of the human race, Adam;

EVEN SO,

your legal justification was brought about by the act of your divinely appointed representative head of His people, Christ Jesus.

Your vital/personal condemnation was brought about when you were brought into being through your conception in the womb of your mother;

EVEN SO,

your vital/personal justification is brought about when God effectually called you out of your native state of condemnation and death to that of justification and life.

Your practical/experiential condemnation is brought about by your actual acts of sins; they evidence your state of condemnation, and defile and condemn your conscience;

EVEN SO,

your practical/experiential justification is brought about by your acts of believing, they certify your justified state, your faith vindicates your justified state by God's free and sovereign grace.

EVEN SO, i.e. in the exact parallel manner...

Your justified state by the free grace of God is experienced by faith alone in Jesus Christ alone! It's not by observing the ceremonial laws as the Judaizers insisted; Apostle Paul marshalled Father Abraham to slap the Judaizer kids in their faces for such a silly nonsense..

Your justification by the free grace of God (the MANNER of your justification) is based solely upon Christ's righteousness and blood (the BASIS of your justification), i.e. His faithfulness in executing the work of redeeming all those whom God to Father had given to Him.

"You are justified by faith alone" (the popular sola fideism)
is vastly different from saying
"Your justification by the free grace of God can be experienced by faith alone in Jesus Christ alone!" 

Hell and the Lake of Fire Confounded

 

Rev 20:15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

The Scriptures declare the lake of fire but Paul Washer replaces with hell as though they are synnymous.

Mr. Washer fails to distinguish hell from the lake of fire, like multitudes of others.

Hell is ONLY for the intermediate state after death.

The lake of fire is the eternal state after the general resurrection.

Hell is everlasting; it lasts as long as time lasts.

Hell shall be emptied at the end of time.

That which is everlasting lasts to the end of time.

The lake of fire is eternal.

.

Rev 20
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

i. Christ Jesus holds both the keys of hell and of death.
Revelation 1:18 KJV — I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

ii. At the end of time, both death (that holds the bodies of the dead) and hell (that holds the spirits of the dead) shall surrender up all its captives to Him who holds the keys of hell and of death.
- Hell shall be EMPTY,  with no one remaining in it any more. That shall be the end of the purpose and relevance of hell, and death too.
- BOTH death and hell shall be cast Into the lake of fire; they will NEVER trouble God's redeemed ever again.
- The second death is the death of both death and hell.

iii. Death [holding the bodies] and hell [holding the spirits] shall deliver up their captives for the general resurrection and judgement.

- those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life shall be ushered into their eternal inheritance in heaven; those whose names are not written in the book of life, THAT IS, NOT REDEEMED BY CHRIST, shall be cast into the lake of fire.

- YES, there are those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life who ended up in hell BUT such shall not end up in the lake of fire. They shall be surrendered up to Christ and be resurrected to glory. (Read all those solemn warnings by Christ on hell addressed to the disciples: hell can be avoided by taking drastic measures in dealing with sins.
- A man's place in the lake of fire is determined SOLELY by whether his name is written in the Lamb's book of life.

iv. The spirits of the righteous in paradise (distinct from heaven) shall come with Christ at His coming and be united with their resurrected bodies.

Just my minority non-conformist view.
You can have yours.

=========

Roger
Amen

Ann
So, Brother Sing, are you saying that Hell will be the temporary punishment of the elect who never submit their lives to Christ while living here or may be lapsed Christians? Who then will be taken up to glory with Christ at the end of time?

Sing F Lau
Ann: Hell is the intermediate state, thus temporary, between death and resurrection.

In the intermediate state, God's children are either in paradise or in hell; in the eternal state, ALL God children shall be in heaven; those whose names were not written in the book of life, unredeemed, shall be cast into the lake of fire.

Ann
Sing, That's what I got from your post but you also said "hell can be avoided by taking drastic measures in dealing with sins."

Do you mean to say it is like punishment or judgment for sin, that will be conquered upon our final resurrection when those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life (the elect?) are made perfect in eternity with Christ?

Sing
The punishment or judgement for sin - the wages of which is eternal damnation in the lake of fire - has been fully paid by Christ; He saved His people from the lake of fire by His works of redemption.

The temporal hell, the realm of the spirits of the dead during the intermediate state, is not so much punishment/judgement for sin; it's more correctional/chastening.

These words are addressed to God's children.
Hebrews 12
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

For many, the chastening continues beyond death.

Hebrews 10:31 KJV — It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Just my understanding.

Christ solemnly warned His disciples to take drastic measures to avoid hell.

Matthew 5
1 ¶ And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him:
2 And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying...
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Mark 9
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Why did the Lord so solemnly repeated the warning of hell to His disciples if there is no possibility hell for His OWN disciples. Some think the Lord Jesus Christ is joking or wasting words. 

Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

Dr. M Morrow
Sing,  I thank you for your answer to my last question. Here are a couple more... again, I am being honest and wondering how someone who holds your theological position thinks about these things. 

When Paul was on trial and said to Agrippa (Acts 26: 29) that he desired that he (Agrippa) and all that heard Paul speak that day were like him (Paul), that is, Christians, was Paul expressing a fleshly desire?  Also, in Romans 9, when Paul expressed a desire for his brethren (in the flesh), fleshly Israel might be saved...even (were it possible...) the sacrifice of his own soul...for their salvation... was that fleshly and wrong? 
Just wondering how you deal with these passages because they seem at first glance to express a desire in Paul's heart for the salvation of people who obviously were not elect people.

Thanks, your learning brother,
Michael Morrow

================

Brother Morrow,
You ask really good questions. I am always being taught by good questions - they drive me to study the Scriptures.

Let me make sure I get your question correct.
" 27 King Agrippa, believest thou the prophets? I know that thou believest.
28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.
29 And Paul said, I would to God, that not only thou, but also all that hear me this day, were both almost, and altogether such as I am, except these bonds.

Was Paul expressing a fleshly desire?

No, not at all, but a true and sincere HUMAN desire, a genuine expression of the great commandment: "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." A child of God desires good for his fellow men generally... He desired for them the transformation that he had... once a blasphemous enemy of the gospel, but now a follower of Jesus Christ.

The desire of God is compatible with His will and decree. He WILL NOT desire nor command those for whom He did not give Christ to be their Saviour to believe Christ Jesus to be their Saviour.

The desire of a child of God is compatible with God's will for him... "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself", and that includes desiring the good that one has for the neighbours.

MM @ "Also in Romans 9, when Paul expressed a desire for his brethren (in the flesh), fleshly Israel might be saved...even (were it possible...) the sacrifice of his own soul...for their salvation..was that fleshly and wrong? Just wondering how... you deal with these passages because they seem at first glance to express a desire in Paul's heart for the salvation of people who obviously were not elect people.

The narrative does express Paul's desire for the salvation of the people under consideration... the great heaviness and continual sorrow in his heart are sincere and genuine.

There are several considerations here:
- What is the salvation that the apostle desires for the people under consideration? Was it eternal salvation by God's free grace, or a salvation that is dependent upon Paul's life and ministry?
- Would the apostle Paul be speaking of the salvation that is wholly and entirely by the free grace of God that he has so copiously asserted and demonstrated throughout the whole epistle?

I believe the apostle Paul desired the temporal salvation that comes to the children of God among the Jews ONLY through believing in the Lord Jesus Christ.

- Who exactly are the people under consideration? Brethren in the flesh. Did he mean 'all the Jews indiscriminately' or God's children who are among the Jews. I believe the context demands the latter.

Apostle Paul was dealing with a very unique problem among the children of God among the Jews - even though they WERE children of God, but BECAUSE of their old covenant background, they found letting go of the old covenant very hard, and enter the kingdom of heaven by believing in Jesus Christ a great stumbling block.

When Apostle Paul stated, "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel" - it is obvious that his concern WAS NOT with the PHYSICAL Israel, but the spiritual Israel among the Jews. They needed to be brought to the faith. The natural Jews WILL NEVER be able to be brought to the Jews.

"8 So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because ye were dear unto us."
=======

What do the words "imparted... also our own souls...?"

John Gill said this:
- but also our own souls, or "lives"; which is the highest expression and strongest proof of love that can be given; and respect is still had to the similitude of the nursing mother, who may be said to impart her blood, for such it her milk diversified, for the nourishment of her children: and such was the great concern of the apostles for the interest of Christ, the spread of the Gospel, and the good of souls, that their lives were not dear unto them, so that these ends might he answered: because ye were dear unto us; both because they were loved by God, redeemed by Christ, regenerated by the Spirit of Christ, and had the image of Christ stamped upon them; and also because that they were their spiritual children; and as children are dear to their parents, so were these to them, even to such a degree, as that, were there a necessity for it, they could freely have laid down their lives for them

Don't confound grace with works

Sir, what about this passage
(the inquirer quoted from NIV)

Romans 10 KJT
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

========

My apologies. I'm catching up.

This passage is an excellent example of the distinction between eternal salvation and temporal salvation. When the students of God's word fail to acknowledge the biblical distinction, they are messed up; they confound grace and works, ALWAYS!

Let's ask a few questions. I teach learners by asking questions so that they will become self-learning.

1. Who is able to confess "Jesus is Lord"? Who is able to believe in his heart that God has raised Jesus from the dead?
- one still dead in their trespasses and sins, OR
- one whom God has already saved, i.e. effectually called out of his native state of condemnation, death, and alienation to grace and salvation in Christ Jesus?

2. If the latter, what will his believing the truths of his salvation in Jesus Christ save him FROM then?

3. What did God, in Jesus Christ, save him from?

4. Is the salvation freely bestowed to him by the grace of God in Jesus Christ the same as the salvation that will be obtained by his work of believing the truth of his salvation?
- Why?

5. "...that you believe and are justified..." (from NIV)
- How does your act of believing justify you?
- How did God justify you?

The right answers to these questions will put you a few light-years ahead of not a few reformed and deformed theologians. 

The Order of the Salvation by Grace

September 21, 2023

#orderofsalvation

Romans 8:30 KJT
Moreover, whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

#salvation_purposed
#salvation_accomplished
#salvation_applied
       (#salvation_experienced)
#salvation_consummated

God sovereignly purposed the eternal salvation of His elect in eternity;

Christ sovereignly accomplished the eternal salvation of all the elect on the cross.

The eternal salvation purposed and accomplished is sovereignly applied to each elect personally in the effectual calling of each elect out of his native state of sin and death to that state of grace and salvation in Jesus Christ.

To call an elect out of his native state of sin and death to that state of grace and salvation in Jesus Christ, these divine activities must take place, in this number and logical order:

- justification by God's grace to deal with the condemnation (justification reverses the condemnation due to sins;)

- regeneration by the Spirit of God to deal with the spiritual deadness due to sins (regeneration quickens the dead with eternal life;)

- adoption by the Father into the divine family to deal with the alienation due to sins. Adoption is always accompanied by the bestowal of the Spirit to dwell in the adopted.

These divine activities - three in number, and in that logical number - are necessary to bring an elect out of his native state of sin and death to that state of grace and salvation in Jesus Christ.

This divine call is always effectual; it always accomplishes its purpose and end - WITHOUT any aid on the part of man whatsoever.
The effect is immutable; once effectually called by God, one remains immutably called. Nothing further is needed on his part for his glorification. The effectually called are perfectly fit for eternal glory. Nothing further is required; they have been saved by grace alone. The divine effectual call deals with their *BEING* as the children of God.

1 John 3:1 KJV — "Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not."

God is not just interested in making His elect fit for heaven; He wants them to be informed and useful in their brief lives here on earth. To this end, the gospel ministry was ordained to call out His effectually called children and gather them into local churches under the Headship of Jesus Christ. This is DISCIPLESHIP; this requires the active part of the effectually called to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling; they are responsible for their spiritual *WELLBEING* as they journey through this world.

Meditate on these things.

They will get you beyond and above the reformed shibboleths.

[9/14, 9:42 PM] Sing Lau:

Concerning sanctification:

There are what the theologians termed "definitive sanctification" and "practical sanctification."

The effectual call definitively, once for all and immutably sets an elect apart from condemnation, death, and alienation to that of grace and eternal salvation in Jesus Christ.

The definitive sanctification is wholly by divine activities alone; it makes practical sanctification in His children possible. The gospel ministry is the divinely appointed means for the practical ongoing sanctification of His children here on earth.

[9/14, 9.48 PM] 
SDC inquirer - Leongsy
Positional sanctification and progressive sanctification

9/14, 10.02 PM]
Sing Lau:
Positional is a good term, it deals with the objective standing or status of a person.

Progressive is an unfortunate term: it implies linear progress, which is rarely true. So many of God's children make shipwrecks of their faith, with no progress whatsoever. Because of this "progressive" understanding, the reformed people will write off God's children as not being God's children because they failed to make the progress expected... that the fruitless hearers cannot possibly be the children of God...

[9/14, 10.04 PM]
SDC inquirer:
So u don't agree that those who are fruitless are not saved?

9/15, 1 9.22 PM]
Sing Lau:
Do remember a few things:
i. The parable describes something about the kingdom of God  - how the people in the kingdom of God hear the preached word. The parable is about the good and poor discipleship of God's children concerning the hearing of God's word.

- The 4 types of hearers are all God's children, those already saved by God.

ii. Common sense tells us that fruitfulness is expected of those who are spiritually alive, i.e. those whom God HAS SAVED by His grace in Jesus Christ.

- Only those lacking common sense expect fruitfulness from spiritually dead hearers.

- living plants that are fruitless is a sad reality. Only foolish people complain about the fruitlessness of a dead plant.

iii. Fruit-bearing requires great effort from God's children; they must work out their own salvation with fear and trembling.
- they have been saved with eternal salvation in Jesus Christ; His work has redeemed them from the eternal lake of fire.
- they must labour to save themselves from ignorance, ungodliness, fruitlessness, etc., relating to their spiritual WELLBEING.

Divine activities ALONE secured the eternal salvation for God's elect; God holds His children (the elect to whom eternal salvation has been applied)  responsible for using the means He has provided for their *temporal salvation*  - their spiritual well-being and usefulness while He lends them breath in their brief life on earth.