Some Questions on "By grace... through faith."

 

Ephesians 2:1-9 “By grace… through faith”.
Through whose and what faith?

"8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 not of works, lest any man should boast."

Verse 8 is so often quoted to mean that a man is saved by grace through faith, i.e. his act of believing.

Read the passage with a dose of common sense, and you will see some obvious reasons why such understanding plainly contradicts what the passage says.
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Some preliminary observations:
a. “by grace” speaks of the MANNER God saves. It is God who saves in and through His Son Jesus Christ.
- God saves by grace, His free and sovereign grace; “by grace” excludes activities/works of man by man.
- Rom 11:6 grace and works are mutually exclusive in the salvation of sinners.

b. “through faith” speaks of the MEANS through/by which salvation is freely bestowed, i.e. by grace.

c. Quickening one dead in trespasses and sins is the bestowal of eternal salvation… saved by grace, v1.5,8.

Let us unpack the passage by asking some relevant questions:

Q1. What state were you in when were you saved by grace through faith?
- v1 “who were dead in trespasses and sins”
- v5 “we were dead in sins…”
- Dead concerning any ability to bring himself to God; hostile and in enmity against Him. “by nature the children of wrath.” Under the dominion of the prince of the power of the air

Q2. When you were dead in sins, were you able to exercise faith to believe in Christ?
- No. Many imagine they can.  
- John 3:3,6; 1Cor 2:14

Q3. Supposing faith is the gift of God, is the gift of faith to a spiritually dead man of any use to him? 
- No. A spiritually dead man can't receive the gift, let alone use the gift. Period.

Q4. Do you believe in a God who would give the gift of faith to a spiritually dead man so that he could exercise that faith in order to be saved by His grace?
- No, the all-wise God doesn't do such silly foolish thing;  only foolish preachers do.
- Faith is NOT the gift; eternal salvation by Jesus Christ is the gift.
- A gift comes to you from without; faith is a spiritual fruit of the Spirit, worked within a child of God. Gal 5:22.

Q5. What then is the gift of God? What is by grace?
- The gift is the eternal salvation by grace; the context speaks of salvation by God's grace.
- The eternal salvation is freely bestowed, applied to an elect when he was dead in trespasses and sins, incapable of faith.

Q6. What is the ground and basis of this gift of God?
- It is the finished work of Christ in redeeming His people.
- It is by His life (active obedience to secure righteousness) and death (passive obedience to secure the forgiveness of sins). Heb 9:12, 15

Q7 "... through faith..."
- is a man's act of believing in Christ performed by him?  Yes.
- is an act performed by a man his work? Yes.
- if a man is saved by grace through his act of believing, then isn't he saved by grace through his own work? Yes
- John 6:28-9    - 1 John 3:23 
- “NOT of works.” So, it is NOT through man's act of believing.

Q8. Why does "by grace" necessarily remove "through faith" from any association with man's exercise of faith?
- Rom 11:6 grace and works are mutually exclusive in the eternal salvation of sinners.
- So, “through faith” can have NOTHING to do with the believing act of man.

Q9. If a man is saved by grace through his act of believing, then he has at least some valid ground to boast, hasn't he?
- Yes, indeed.
- Then “through faith” CANNOT be associated with any activities of man. Otherwise, contradicts “lest any man…”

Q10. If he did not perform his act of believing, would he be saved by grace through his faith?
- No.
- Therefore “through faith” CANNOT be associated with any activities of man; otherwise, it’s through his works.

Q11. Since it's not through your act of faith, then you are saved through WHOSE faith, and WHAT is that faith?
- The faith OF Christ
- The faithfulness of Jesus Christ in His work of redemption, fulfilling all the conditions in saving/redeeming His people.

Q12. Have you read of the phrase “faith of Christ," i.e. His faithfulness in executing the work of redeeming those given to Him by the Father?
- Romans 3:22
- Galatians 2:16; 2:20; 3:22
- Philippians 3:9

This is the gospel truth that has been repudiated in almost all modern translations. Instead of "the faith OF Christ", all the modern translations have twisted the "faith of Christ" into "faith in Christ." 

Check for yourself... read the King James translation.

 

"I will come again, and receive you unto myself..."

"I will come again, and receive you unto myself;
that where I am, there ye may be also."
THAT IS...
You WON'T be where Jesus is UNTIL He comes AGAIN
to receive you unto Himself,
so that where He is, there you may be also!!!

Kenchin
Hello Pr Lau in the bible study last Wed. You mentioned that Paradise was an intermediate state where the Lord Jesus was absent.  As you are aware, the Greek word for Paradise is used 3 times - Luke 23:43 – As He hung upon the cross, Jesus assured the repentant criminal, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.” The promise locates Paradise in the immediate presence of Christ, accessible at the moment of death for the believer.

2 Corinthians 12:4 – Paul speaks of being “caught up to Paradise and heard inexpressible words, things that man is not permitted to tell.” His vision authenticates Paradise as a real, conscious realm beyond earthly experience.

John Gill - heaven is called paradise, because as the garden of Eden, which bears that name, was of God's planting, so is this made and prepared by him; as that was a delightful place, so is this; also because of Christ the tree of life, which is in the midst of it, besides an innumerable company of angels, and spirits of just men made perfect. Revelation 2:7 – The risen Lord promises the overcomer “the right to eat from the tree of life in the paradise of God. Paradise is where God and our Lord Jesus Christ are present.
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Sing
Brother Kenchin, thanks for your thoughts on the bible study.
Paradise (para-deisos) does indeed occur 3 times, as you have indicated.
 
It’s indeed common to equate paradise with heaven (ouranos).
The same people also see “hell” (ge'enna) as synonymous with the “lake of fire” (limnē pyr). That’s what I was taught and parroted for 20+ years. I didn’t know better.

Our gracious Lord has given me a little more light on the matter.

1. These are some word facts:
a. Paradise (para-deisos) occurs 3 times in the NT

b. Hell (geenna) occurs 23 times in 23 verses in the NT; 15 times are used by Christ Himself, many of them in the context of His solemn warnings to His own disciples.

c. Heaven (ouranos) occurs 255 times in 237 verses in the NT. Not all refer to that eternal abode of God and resurrected saints.

d. Lake of fire (limnē pyr) - occurs 4 times in 4 verses (Rev 20,21).
(Check these with the helpful BlueLetterBible app.)

2. A careful reading of these relevant texts makes a few things self-evident:
a. Hell and paradise are spoken of in the context of the intermediate/disembodied state: the state between physical death and the resurrection at Christ's second coming.

b.  Hell and paradise are in the context/realm of time between physical death and the general resurrection (which marks the end of time, and the dawn of eternity for man).

c. Hell and paradise are the realms of the spirits of the dead. Their bodies are under the power death.
 
d. The redeemed may end up in hell but NONE in the lake of fire.
- Read all those solemn warnings of Christ addressed to His own disciples. Mt 5:22,29,30. Mt 10:28; 18:9; Mk 9:43.45.47; Disciples must take drastic measures to deal with personal sins to avoid hell.
- There is not one instant of Christ warning His disciples against the lake of fire. Why is that?

e. At the end of time, BOTH death (that holds captive the bodies) and hell (that holds captive the spirits) shall be EMPTIED; death and hell shall surrender all its captives to Him who holds the keys of hell and of death (Rev 1:18) for the general resurrection. Rev 20:13.
- The EMPTIED death and hell shall be cast into the lake of fire. Rev 20:14.
- The spirits that have been ushered into paradise (after the judgment at death) shall accompany Christ in His second coming. 1Th 4:14. These shall be united with their resurrected bodies.

f. Heaven is the abode of the resurrected glorified saints. Those who have part in the first resurrection (Mt 27:52,53) are now in heaven (Rev 20:4-6, a 3-verse paragraph that speaks of the first resurrection)
- The redeemed dead do not enter heaven at death; their spirit either go to paradise or hell.
- Their judgment at death is according to works.
- Their judgment at the resurrection is according to their name in the book of life, redeemed by Christ.

3. You quoted John Gill. Let’s listen to him then on this point:
Commenting on Heb 9:27 “And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.”

He said: "... There is a particular judgment which is immediately after death; by virtue of which, the souls of men are condemned to their proper state of happiness or woe; and there is an universal judgment, which will be after the resurrection of the dead, and is called eternal judgment, and to come..."

The particular (and temporal) judgment which is immediately after death determines the proper state of happiness (paradise) or woe (hell) during the intermediate state.
The universal (and eternal) judgment which follows the general resurrection determines the proper state during the eternal state.

4. I leave you with a few related questions:
a. Why do some preachers preach hell?
- What do they want to achieve by it?
- To whom did Christ preach hell? For what purpose?

5. Christ’s words: John 14:2-3
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

What are some obvious conclusions from these words of Christ?
- What is Christ referring to, paradise or heaven?
- Why must the disciples WAIT till Christ WILL COME AGAIN to be with Him if at death they are ALREADY with Him?
- What shall happen when Christ come again?
- When shall the redeemed be received unto the Father’s house where Christ is?

Feel free to ask any further questions.
I’m still learning. May our Lord bless us learn and grow together Amen.

2Ti 2:7 Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.

=========

Calice
Thanks, pastor, for sharing the exchanges.

Just a quick comment:

Kenchin mentioned 3 main points:

Due to time constraints, I will just comment on the first:
1.  He heard Pastor Lau said Jesus Christ was absent in Paradise.  Did he hear or understand wrongly?

Pastor, please help clarify this first point first. Thanks

Sing
Kenchin @ Hello, Pr Lau, in the bible study last Wed. You mentioned that Paradise was an intermediate state where the Lord Jesus was absent.
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There may be various reasons why he perceived what he heard I said that way...
- His basic presupposition is that paradise is synonymous with the eternal heaven.
- Therefore, if Jesus is not in paradise, then He is not in heaven!
- If Jesus is not in heaven, then where can He be?

Wrong presuppositions have their necessary implications and create unnecessary and false problems.

After death, Jesus' spirit went to paradise. Then His spirit returned and was united to his glorified body at resurrection at dawn of the first day of the week (our Sunday 6 am - 6 pm, first night of the week is Sat 6 pm - Sun 6 am. Jewish week starts on Sat 6pm… )

Genesis 1:5 KJV — And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening (6 pm- 6 am) and the morning (6 am-6 pm) were the first day.

After His resurrection, He was with the disciples for 40 days, Acts 1:3.

Then He ascended to His Father in heaven. Acts 1:9ff

The words of the resurrected Lord to Mary...
John 20:17 KJV — Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

The spirit of Jesus, as real and true a human as anyone who is reading these words, went to the paradise in His disembodied state.

The resurrected Jesus has been received up into heaven.

Rejoice, He shall return one day... He said these words to His disciples.

John 14
1 ¶Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

Did you read - you WON'T be where Jesus is UNTIL He comes AGAIN to receive you unto Himself so that where He is there you may be also???

Sunny
Enoch & prophet Elijah who did not seek death. Are they in Paradise? Or are they already in heaven with our Lord?

Sing
You are right, neither of them seek death.
Also, both Enoch and Elijah did not see/experience death.

Genesis 5:24 KJT — And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

God took him - body and spirit, the whole person. It necessarily implies that God changed/transformed/glorified him, making him fit for habitation in heaven.

Similarly for Elijah.
2 Kings 2:11 KJT — And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

This earthy body of flesh is completely unfit for habitation in heaven; it must be transformed/changed/glorified by God first, i.e. made fit to inhabit heaven.

The same will happen to the redeemed who are still living at Christ's second coming.

1 Corinthians 15 KJT
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

Since they didn't see death (spirit did not separate from the body), they must have been changed/transformed/ glorified, i.e. made fit to dwell in heaven.

What does the gospel do?

What does the gospel do?

 

What does the gospel do? People give various answers; I read one here:

(The picture appears in the right sidebar of the page.) Mr. Washer says, and many believe the same that the "gospel does not call us to receive Christ as an addition to, but as our life."

THAT IS, "the gospel calls us to receive Christ as our life."

REALLY? What happens when you receive Christ as your life?

The gospel is the good news of what God has done for His elect; the gospel calls His children (i.e. those elect whom God has effectually called out of their native state of sin and death to that of grace and salvation in Christ) to believe the truth of their salvation in Jesus Christ, which was freely and sovereignly bestowed upon them when they were in their native state of sin and death.

They have been given eternal life in Jesus Christ, and they are called to believe the truth of their salvation.

To all others, the gospel is foolishness.

Eph 1
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

The gospel announces the grace of God that has accomplished the salvation for His elect, calling those to whom the salvation has been APPLIED personally, to believe on their Saviour Jesus Christ, teaching them...

Titus 2
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Two popular ditches beside the Path of Truth

The two popular ditches beside
the narrow and old in the middle Path of truth.

 

April 21, 2016
Initially posted here:
https://www.facebook.com/sing.f.lau/posts/pfbid02mEYzDeDyP6LXUt2Y5gut3w45fUgSai85ZtkRbZJaUXgbgex8sGsnppHd32ofj45Wl

The two popular ditches beside the narrow and old Path of truth.

Here is a classic example: Calvinism, Arminianism, and the Truth.
https://letgodbetrue.com/sermons/index/year-2006/calvinism-arminianism-and-the-truth/

Do yourself a great favour - read and meditate on the article, and save yourself from the filthy ditches!
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Cantoro Joe
Ai yo! All along, I thought you were for WCF! I thought you were an original Calvinist!

Sing F Lau
You have very misinformed thoughts.
Cantoro, if you care to answer my question directly in plain and simple manner - what's an original calvinist? Are you one?

Cantoro Joe
Westminister Assembly?

Sing F Lau
Cantoro, I don't know whether it is a peculiarity with Singaporeans.
They love saying West-minister instead of West-minster. I have heard several Singaporeans saying "Westminister" instead of "Westminster!"
May be they love their Ministers (politicians) very much!

Now, please tell what the Westminster Assembly teach about justification.

Let me warn you - no regurgitation of reformed shibboleths.

Go to the WCF, and tell me from chapter 11, what they teach about justification.

Show me that they teach justification by faith (man;s act of believing).

And take your time.

Cantoro Joe
Arrgh!!! It's Westminster!!!
Isn't Westminster Reformed??

Cantoro Joe
"God did, from all eternity, decree to justify all the elect;(1) and Christ did, in the fulness of time, die for their sins, and rise again for their justification:(2) nevertheless, they are not justified, until the Holy Spirit doth, in due time, actually apply Christ unto them. (3)

Sing F Lau
Quoting the Westminster Divines DOES NOT show that you understand them. So, tell us what you have quoted. Did they teach that your justification is by your faith, or is that just your own imagination? And please take your time to answer my simple question. No regurgitation of shibboleths, please.

Cantoro Joe
Justification follows the Holy Spirit changing man's will to receive truth.

On Saving Faith
"By this faith, a Christian believeth to be true whatsoever is revealed in the Word, for the authority of God Himself speaking therein;(1) and acteth differently upon that which each particular passage thereof containeth; yielding obedience to the commands,(2) trembling at the threatenings,(3) and embracing the promises of God for this life and that which is to come.(4) But the principal acts of saving faith are accepting, receiving, and resting upon Christ alone for justification, sanctification, and eternal life, by virtue of the covenant of grace. (5)"

Having the gift of saving faith means the sinner is able to fear God and desire to obey all His teachings. That's where the sinner is justified.

Sing F Lau
Cantoro, EXPLAIN what you have quoted, WCF 11.4. Don't run away from that yet! If you are not prepared to explain what you have quoted, then don't quote them. You understand?

Cantoro Joe
Only when God effectually calls a person, meaning the person receives the inward call, then the person has saving faith is justified

Sing F Lau
Is that your explanation for WCF 11.4 that you have quoted?
Here it is, if you have forgotten. Let's just stay here for a while. Don't wander away.

"God did, from all eternity, decree to justify all the elect;(1) and Christ did, in the fulness of time, die for their sins, and rise again for their justification: (2) nevertheless, they are not justified, until the Holy Spirit doth, in due time, actually apply Christ unto them.(3)  (WCF 11:4) 

Sing F Lau
WHERE does WCF 11.4 speak of effectual call, saving faith and all the stuff you read into it? EISEGESIS is reading into the text. I ask for EXEGESIS - reading out of the text.

Tell me what WCF 11.4 declare. Is that a simple task?

Sing F Lau
Good night.

Sing F Lau
Take a look here: https://things-new-and-old.blogspot.com/2012/10/the-doctrine-of-justification-as.html

Cantoro Joe, are you already tired of the all-important subject about justification after ranting your reformed shibboleths?

Didn't someone say that the standing or the falling of a church hinges upon this doctrine???

Para 4.
God did from all eternity decree to justify all the elect, (11) and Christ did in the fullness of time die for their sins, and rise again for their justification;(12) nevertheless, they are not justified personally, until the Holy Spirit doth in time due actually apply Christ unto them.(13) 11. Gal 3:8; 1Pe 1:2; 1Ti 2:6. 12. Ro 4:25. 13. Col 1:21-22; Tit 3:4-7.

This paragraph PLAINLY declares the MULTIFACETED nature of the doctrine of justification.

a. Justification decreed in the purpose of God
- by God for all the elect
- from all eternity

b. Justification secured/accomplished legally: (stated plainly in para. 3)
- by Christ for all the elect
- at the cross

c. Justification applied personally (stated in para. 1)
- by the Holy Spirit to each individual elect.
- at effectual calling to grace and salvation.

d. Justification experienced /evidenced subjectively (stated para. 2)
- by the faith of the individual elect.
- at initial conversion and throughout life.

e. Justification vindicated finally
- by God before the judgment throne
- on the great judgment day

Conclusion: Justification decreed, accomplished, applied, experienced, and finally vindicated.

Your LEGAL justification by Christ's blood/righteousness/faithfulness took place AT the cross, just as your LEGAL condemnation took place at the fall in the garden of Eden.

Your VITAL justification by God's grace took place AT your effectual calling to grace and salvation (while you were DEAD in trespasses and sins), just as your vital/personal condemnation took effect at your conception by your earthly father.

Your EVIDENTIAL/EXPERIENTIAL justification took place at your conversion through faith IN Jesus Christ, just as your experiential condemnation takes place through your acts of sin.

Cantoro, may our Lord open your eyes to see the truth of justification more COMPLETELY, and move from the popular Protestant's lie of faith only!

A biblical distinction is the essence of sound theology.

Reformed/Protestant shibboleths confuse, mislead, and deceive.

"Today is the THIRD DAY since these things were done." Luke 24:21

 https://www.facebook.com/sing.f.lau/posts/pfbid0E8HvwMWRNxj2tJfYGhZKRdSPkbW6HdCEJpfU6KwHmC7CtNKS7aEn6VjRXSYNa9d8l

"... today is the third day SINCE..."

Can you count like the two villagers?

That Sunday morning, two men left Jerusalem and were on their way back to their home in Emmaus. They were speaking of the things that had happened few days before, i.e. the events surrounding the judgment and crucifixion of Christ.

They said, "But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the THIRD DAY SINCE these things were done."  Luke 24:21 

By Sunday, it was *the THIRD day SINCE* those things had happened. 

Let's grant that the two men can at least count up to 3 as well as counting them backward. Also those words were uttered in the presence of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ; they were received and not corrected; thus it is reasonable to assume them to be accurate.  

Questions
- On which day did those things happen?
- On which night was Jesus arrested?
- The early morning of which day did the hastily convened kangaroo court take place?
- Which day was Christ crucified?

Some questions to ask at this time of year when bunnies start laying colourful eggs in the name of remembering Christ.

This village boy can understand their words. To them, those things happened on Thursday. Jesus was arrested on Wednesday night.

Some insist that the phrase "three days and three nights" must be exactly 72hrs and no less. Go figure. Is that how words of common daily usage are to be understood? Do 2plus 12hr-day and 3 12hr-night constitute the phrase 3days and 3 nights? Let's say, if Jesus had wanted to say 68 hours, how should he have expressed himself if not the common usage of "three days and three nights? 

ALSO.... the first 12-hr DAY of the Jewish week is Sunday, 6am-6pm. Don't jump, let me finish! Saturday 6pm - Sunday 6am is the FIRST 12-hr NIGHT of the Jewish week.

Gen 1:5,8,13,19,23,31

"...And the evening and the morning were the first/second/third/fourth/fifth/sixth day."

A Jewish day consisted of 12hr evening (night) and 12hr morning (day).

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"The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him."

 - Leo Tolstoy –

"But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant." - Apostle Paul, a servant of Christ.
-----------------

Rod Wilson
🙂 Amen.
There were two sabbaths in that week. A high or special sabbath, and the weekly sabbath.

John 19:31 (KJV) - "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐬𝐚𝐛𝐛𝐚𝐭𝐡 𝐝𝐚𝐲 𝐰𝐚𝐬 𝐚𝐧 𝐡𝐢𝐠𝐡 𝐝𝐚𝐲,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away."

However, there was a normal working day in between the two sabbaths. The women, who followed Jesus, rested the high Sabbath day of the Passover, before buying and preparing their spices:

Mark 16:1 (KJV) - "And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him."

They bought and prepared their spices on the regular workday between the two Sabbaths days.

Luke 23:55-56 (KJV) - "And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid. And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment."

And then the rested, during the weekly Sabbath day, after buying and preparing their spices the previous workday.

Jesus rose from the dead, as the weekly Sabbath ended – three days and three nights after burial – as prophesied:

Matthew 12:39-40 (KJV) - "But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."
Wednesday: Jesus buried before 6pm.
Thursday: High sabbath.
Friday: Women bought and prepared spices.
Saturday: Weekly sabbath day, and women rested. After 6pm Jesus rose.
Sunday: Early in the morning, women find tomb empty.

Amen.

[Friday: Women bought and prepared spices: you invented this EXTRA day out of thin air just to accommodate the women buying the sweet spices!!! sing]

Sing F Lau
Rod Wilson: Such a scheme would require "to day is the FOURTH day since these things were done" by Sunday late afternoon.

Either the two men from Emmaus were wrong or you are wrong; both can't be correct. I think this is a reasonable conclusion.

Wed 6pm - Thu 6pm : the PASSOVER DAY  
 -  Jesus ate the passover meal with the disciples... later in the night he was arrested. Later on Thu afternoon Jesus was crucified, 
- PART of 1st 12hr day
Thu 6pm - Fri 6pm : the High Sabbath Day.
- 1st 12hr night and 2nd 12hr day
Fri 6pm - Sat 6pm : the weekly sabbath day
- 2nd 12hr night and 3rd 12hr day
Sat 6pm - Sun 6pm : the first 24hr day of the week
Sat 6pm - Sun 6am : the first 12-hr night of the week
- 3rd 12hr day and 3rd 12hr night. 2+ 12hr days and 3 12hr nights have PASSED. 
Sun 6am - Sun 6pm : the first 12-hr day of the week.
Jesus rose early on Sunday morning, after the THIRD night (Sat 6pm - Sun 6am) ended. Jesus repeatedly said, It is "three days and three nights."

Your scheme is "three nights and three days! 

On Thursday evening (still part of the Passover day), after the women returned from the burial scene, they PREPARED spices and ointments. The next day was the high sabbath. This was followed by the weekly sabbath. 

Luke 23:55-56 (KJV) - "And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid. And they returned, and PREPARED spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment."

After the weekly sabbath ended on Saturday 6pm, the beginning of the first 12-hr night of the first 24-hr day of the week, the women BOUGHT sweet spices. 

Mark 16:1 (KJV) - "And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had BOUGHT sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him."

"HAD BOUGHT" - the past perfect tense indicates the earlier of the two past events that are connected: the act of buying the sweet spices is EARLIER than the act of coming to the tomb to anoint Jesus. 

Too many cannot distinguish "prepared spices and ointments" and "bought sweet spices." They are two distinct events, and different occasions. 

Rod Wilson
🙂 Thank you, brother Sing.

Clearly some are wrong. Were the women wrong to be purchasing and preparing herbs on a sabbath day, or, as you say, the two men were wrong.

Your Post also points out, that Jesus did not correct the two men. However, if Jesus prophesied "three days and three nights", I would be inclined to believe Him.

The important matter is, not so much the day of His death, but His resurrection from the dead. Jesus answered the two men:

Luke 24:25-27 (KJV) - "Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and 𝐭𝐨 𝐞𝐧𝐭𝐞𝐫 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐠𝐥𝐨𝐫𝐲? And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself."

Amen.

Sing F Lau
Rod Wilson,  Luke 23:55-56 (KJV) 'And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulcher, and how his body was laid. And they returned [from the burial], and prepared spices and ointments, and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.'

There was no buying. 

Mark 16:1 (KJV) - "And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him."

There was buying here but ONLY when "... the sabbath was past... HAD BOUGHT..."

The past perfect "HAD bought" indicates that the buying took place after the passing of the sabbath, after Sat 6pm BUT before going to the tomb early in the morning. 

The religious authorities requested the tomb be guarded on the Saturday night (Sat 6pm -Sun 6am.) They understood from Jesus' words of "three days and three nights" that He would rise AFTER the third night, i.e. AFTER the night of Sat 6pm-Sun 6am. To place the guards AFTER Jesus had already risen would make the religious leaders to be idiots who cannot count also. 

Your scheme says Jesus rose shortly after Saturday at 6pm.

I have heard it before. A pastor-friend in Greenville, SC, believes the same.