Modern versus Ancient; New versus Old
vs
Ancient Evangelicals
"Modern Evangelicals preach the same
Gospel that was proclaimed in the First Century. We preach that Jesus was born
of a virgin, lived a sinless life, died an atoning death, and rose bodily from
the grave. We preach that man is a sinner and stands guilty before God in need
of salvation. We preach that God offers salvation by grace, through faith, in
Jesus Christ alone, and the moment anyone repents of his sin, puts his faith in
Jesus, and calls upon His name, that person is born again. That’s the Gospel
they preached, and the Gospel we preach." - Steve Gaines, a mega SBC
church pastor, in his Kindle book "Pray Like It Matters."
Sing F Lau
Mr. Steve Gaines affirms that Modern IvanHELLicals preach these:
1. Jesus was born of a virgin, lived a
sinless life, died an atoning death, and rose bodily from the grave.
2. Man is a sinner and stands guilty before
God in need of salvation.
3. God offers salvation by grace, through
faith, in Jesus Christ alone
4. The moment anyone repents of his sin, puts
his faith in Jesus, and calls upon His name, that person is born again.
That’s the gospel that Mr. Gaines and Modern
IvanHELLicals preach.
Sing F Lau
Mr. Steve Gaines claims that he preaches the
SAME gospel preached by the apostolic evangelists of the first century.
Does anyone agree with that?
Thanks.
Sing F Lau
4. "The moment anyone repents of his
sin, puts his faith in Jesus, and calls upon His name, that person is born
again.
=======
Is there one smallest shred of gospel/good
news in this?
What good news is this smooth sounding
promise to one who is not born again yet, i.e who is still dead in trespasses
and sins?
This statement is actually a very cruel,
wicked, and grievous mockery to anyone who is not born again, i.e anyone
still dead in trespasses and sins. Such smooth words bring no good news, it
leaves the dead in their deadness.
It is like making the promise of the dead,
"The moment anyone smells his deadness, puts his trust in life, and calls
upon life, that person is brought to life." It is a cruel, wicked, and
grievous mockery. It is no good news.
Is anyone who is not born again, i.e. still
dead in trespasses and sin, able to repent of his sins, able to put his faith
in Jesus, or calls upon Christ?
What is the nature of anyone who is in his
native state of sin and death, i.e. not born again yet?
Do you actually believe Christ's own words
which He REPEATEDLY declared,
"Except a man be born again, he
CANNOT....... HE CANNOT......."
Christ repeatedly stated the ABSOLUTELY
NECESSITY, and the PRIORITY of the new birth before the performance of any
spiritual activity like believing, repenting and calling upon the name of
Christ. Do you believe that life must be prior to the activities of that life?
VERY MANY are too MODERN for the ANCIENT
truth from Christ Himself.
Steve Chong
3. Faith is a fruit of the Spirit ... so how
a fruit can be turned into the cause of salvation is quite baffling.
4. The words "born again" certainly
mean that someone must have been dead in the first place, else it is impossible
to be born again because he was never dead to begin with. And hence, can a dead
person do anything? (such as repent, put his faith ... in the first place, he
hasn't got any faith, let alone put his faith). Surely, it has to take a living
person to be able to repent, put his faith ...
"Does anyone agree with that?" ...
well, 9 out of 10 (it's probably closer to 10 out of 10) agree with that .....
and that makes me quite lonely *LOL* ..... but, just got to remember that the
majority was outside Noah's ark ...
Sing F Lau
4. "The moment anyone repents of his
sin, puts his faith in Jesus, and calls upon His name, that person is born
again.
=======
This statement is INIMICAL to the gospel of
the grace of God.
inimical - adjective, harmful, injurious,
detrimental, deleterious, prejudicial, damaging, hurtful, destructive, ruinous,
pernicious; antagonistic, contrary, antipathetic, unfavorable, adverse,
opposed; hostile, unkind, unsympathetic, unfriendly, ill-disposed, malevolent;
unwelcoming, cold, frosty; literary malefic. See note at hostile. antonym
friendly, favorable.
The statement declares that a man's new birth
is CONDITIONED UPON his activities of repenting his sins, putting his faith in
Jesus, calling upon the name of Jesus. It repudiates salvation by the free and
sovereign grace of God!
A man who IS dead in trespasses and sins must
perform these activities in order to be born again of God. Stupid and deluded men
insist this is good news! Right-minded men believe such is insult and mockery
of the dead!
Requiring a dead man to perform these duties
in order to be born again is no gospel at all.
Valluri Vara Prasad
Gospel unchanged, only humankind stone heart
Charles Dohring
I agree with Sing. and Steve Some will say in
the last day LORD, LORD, and Jesus will say I never knew you. So there is more
to salvation like fruit than just calling on the LORD.
Sing F Lau
3. God offers salvation by grace, through
faith, in Jesus Christ alone
=======
God offers salvation! To whom does He offer
it? Surely to those without salvation! Offering salvation to those without
salvation sounds really kind and benevolent and gracious, doesn't it?
Now, what is offered requires the acceptance
of it by them who are without salvation. Surely that is common sense enough!
Think for a moment, please. What is the
spiritual condition of those to whom God offers salvation? Those without
salvation are still in their native state of sin and condemnation, i.e.
spiritually dead in trespasses and sins. Such has no desire nor capability to
accept the offer, no matter how sincere and fantastic the offer maybe! In
fact, he is hostile and in enmity towards the good news of salvation.
What does that imply? Either the modern
ivanHELLicals are very stupid themselves, or they foolishly make God appear
very stupid like themselves. For only a stupid dumb god will offer salvation to sinners who are dead in trespasses and sins, THAT IS, condemned and dead
spiritually, and wholly unable to accept, but instead actively consider such
salvation as foolishness.
No American is stupid enough to offer an
American big-Mac to a dead American, but modern evangelicals believe in a
stupid god who offers salvation to sinners dead in trespasses and sins.
Smart but superstitious Chinese do offer
roast swine to their dead ancestors, and the swine ends up in their own
bellies!
God DOES NOT offer salvation! Instead, He
sovereignly and unilaterally and actively APPLIES / BESTOWS the salvation to
individual elect who are spiritually dead in their trespasses and sins.
To say otherwise is to take the name of God
in vain. It is to bear false witness of God. It is to impugn His wisdom!
Jesus DID NOT offer life to Lazarus. He
sovereignly and unilaterally SUMMONED Lazarus out of death to life! Supposing
Jesus had offered life to Lazarus, what good would the offer have done to him?
What good? Zilch!
stupid |ˈst(y)oōpid|
adjective ( -pider, -pidest)
lacking intelligence or common sense.
Such is the modern evenHELLicals!!!
Jorge Quierrez Jr.
haha, what a sense smart words! it's a hard saying to the stupid ones,
Sing F Lau
3. God offers salvation by grace, through faith, in Jesus Christ alone.
=======
God DOES NOT offer salvation, and waits for
that salvation to be accepted! The all-wise God does not do such a foolish and
stupid thing!
He sovereignly and unilaterally bestows
salvation, and EFFECTUALLY calls an elect out of his native state of sin and
death into the state of righteousness and life. An elect is conceived in sin,
born in sin, grew up under the dominion of sin... until God intervened
sovereignly!!!)
He BESTOWS salvation... He bestows it freely
without man meeting any condition. If there were any conditions that a man must
meet to be given salvation, that condition would never be met by man.
God BESTOWS salvation by His grace... without
any condition, NOT even through faith. A man without salvation is death in
trespasses and sins, and is in enmity against God, and is incapable of
exercising faith, much less believing in Christ alone! Such show enmity and
hostility, not faith!
God BESTOWS salvation freely, i.e. by grace
alone. This describes the manner in which that salvation is bestowed. But the
salvation that is bestowed freely is a salvation that is based solely on the
faith OF-OF-OF Jesus Christ alone.
The salvation that is freely bestowed by God
is the salvation accomplished and secured through the faithfulness of Christ in
meeting all the conditions for the redemption of His people. His faithfulness
secured the full and perfect righteousness needed by His people, and His
faithfulness atoned for all the sins of all His people. Salvation is based
solely upon the finished work of Jesus Christ.
Faith in Jesus Christ is an effect, a fruit,
a consequence of the salvation freely bestowed by God's free grace. An effect
of salvation CANNOT possibly be the means to obtain the same salvation.
Breath is an effect of life. An effect of
life can't possibly be the means or instrument to obtain that same life! A dead
man cannot breathe in order to become alive! Only stupid people think
otherwise.
Robert Cook Sr.
Excellent!!
Sing F Lau
2. Man is a sinner and stands guilty before
God in need of salvation.
=======
At best this is very deficient, and
therefore misleading and deceiving statement of the STATE/condition of man in
his native state of sin. Such a deficient understanding of the true state of man
leads these MODERN ivanHELLicals to believe that sinners are able to perform
spiritual acts in order to be saved by God!
Christ repeatedly said except a sinner be
born again from above, he remains in his NATIVE STATE of spiritual deadness and
cannot and will not perform any spiritual activities! Let Christ be true but
every modern ivanHELLicals a LIAR.
Man is not just a sinner; he is spiritually
dead in trespasses and sins. That is, in his native state, he is not only
devoid of any ability to draw nigh unto God, but he is also positively hostile towards,
and in enmity against God. He is utterly incapable of receiving the things of
the Spirit. He has no ability to discern spiritual things. The gospel is
complete foolishness to him.
Modern ivanHELLicals diagnose sinners are
spiritually SICK.
Apostolic evangelical diagnose sinners as
spiritually DEAD!
Sick sinners are still capable of doing a few
feeble things to get themselves saved. That's why modern ivanHELLicals imagine
that sick sinners CAN, and must perform a few things to get themselves saved!
Dead sinners are utterly helpless in and of
themselves! They are completely dependent upon external power acting upon them
if any of them are to be saved - as dead a Lazarus was in the tomb, and
completely dependent upon the resurrecting power of Christ the life-giver to
raise him from the dead. Sinners are not even passive nor neutral. Sinners'
neutrality is a lie from the pit of hell! They are positively and actively
hostile and in enmity towards all things of the Spirit of God!!! They don't
seek God!
This basic and fundamental fact points to the
absolute necessity of salvation by the free and sovereign grace of God! God
freely and sovereignly bestows eternal salvation to sinners who are dead in
trespasses and sins.
Charles Dohring
You did not have to accept your physical life
GOD gave you what makes u think u have to accept spiritual life when he gives
it
Sing F Lau
1. Jesus was born of a virgin, lived a
sinless life, died an atoning death, and rose bodily from the grave.
=======
The truth stated here concerning WHO Jesus is, and
WHAT He has done, are true enough. The big trouble is that the necessary
implications of these truths, especially the latter, are neither noted nor
understood! Let me explain.
Jesus lived a sinless life!
- He lived a sinless life of perfect
obedience to all the laws of God.
- He lived a sinless life of perfect
obedience to all the laws of God as a substitute, in the stead of His people,
those whom God has given to Him.
- He did this to save His people. He did this
to secure the perfect righteousness which is the absolute necessity for the
justification of His people before God.
- Sins, the transgression of God's law,
brings condemnation and death.
- Righteousness, the obedience to God's law,
secures justification and life.
Rom 3
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there
shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of
sin.
21 But now the righteousness of God without
the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by
faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no
difference:
23 For all have sinned, and come short of the
glory of God;
24 Being justified freely by his grace
through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
The righteousness of God's provision is
through the redemptive work of Jesus Christ. Justification of condemned dead
sinners is on the basis of that righteousness which God Himself has provided
through His Son Jesus Christ!
Jesus lived a sinless life on behalf of His
people, those whom the Father has given to Him before the foundation of the world,
to secure the righteousness for their justification unto life.
Rom 5
18 Therefore as by the offence of one
judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one
the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were
made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
It is by the perfectly sinless life of Jesus
that a sinner is justified and accepted before God. It is not by or because of
the actions of the sinner at all. All the actions of a man towards God are the
EFFECTS of his justification unto life by the free grace of God.
Justification unto life is through the
REDEMPTION that is in Christ Jesus.
Justification unto life is NOT through your
faith in Christ Jesus.
Justification unto life through the
REDEMPTION that is in Christ Jesus is APPLIED to a sinner under the
condemnation of death FREELY by God's grace, i.e. not by anything that sinner
does!
Sing F Lau
1. Jesus was born of a virgin, lived a
sinless life, died an atoning death, and rose bodily from the grave.
=======
Jesus died an atoning death!
- Jesus lived the life that His people, under
the condemnation of death, are INCAPABLE of living to attain the justification
unto life.
- Jesus died the dead that His people, under
the condemnation of death, DESERVE to die.
- The death that Jesus died bore away the
curse and condemnation that is due to all the sins of all His people.
- The wages of sin is death. All the sins of
all His people were imputed to Him, and He bore and suffered for all the sins
of all His people when He endured the hell of being forsaken by God... a hell
every sinner deserves!
- Jesus died in the place of His people to
bear away completely the full and righteous wrath of God that is due to His
people.
- He paid the full and complete price for the
redemption of His people. 'It is finished,' He declared.
- There is nothing else for His people to do
to be saved. The redemption Jesus Christ has accomplished is APPLIED freely and
sovereignly by the Spirit of God to each of Christ's people at their appointed
time.
- Once that redemption is applied to each
personally, they are made capable of responding to the gospel ministry of declaring
to them the truth of their salvation by God's grace through the redemption that
is in Jesus Christ.
His ATONING death DID ATONE (simple past
tense, a done thing, completed and settled) for all the sins of all His people.
The eternal condemnation due to their sins was once, and forever dealt with and
SETTLED.
Heb 9:12 "Neither by the blood of goats
and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having
obtained eternal redemption for us."
Having obtained! Having obtained what? ETERNAL
REDEMPTION. For who? For us, i.e. everyone, as many as, whom God the Father has
given to Jesus Christ.
Let modern ivanHELLicals deal with, and spell
out the implications of what they claim that Jesus has done when they mutter
that "Jesus lived a sinless life, died an atoning death." Otherwise, it is just cheapskate religious shibboleths that mislead and deceive!
Jorge Quierrez Jr.
excellent! The only doctrine that gave glory, and
honour to our God, is the doctrine that we are saved by grace alone.
