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| These are soulmates; They don't have souls, They are living souls. |
November 1, 2011
Man DOES NOT HAVE a soul.
Man is - is - is a living soul.
When his body and spirit are in union, man is a
living soul.
When his body and spirit separate, man is a dead
corpse, not a living soul.
Ge 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of
the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a
living soul.
Ec 11:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as
it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you
wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved
blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
While alive, the Lord preserves our whole soul.
While dead, the Lord preserves BOTH our whole body and spirit... that they may
be united again into a glorified living soul. Blessed be our Lord God.
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20 Comments
Alan Lloyd
Well explained pastor, that clears up a lot of
confusion, thanks.
Charles Page
amazing how people cling to the greek concept of the
body being a vessel and containing a soul/spirit
(Matthew Ong posted many comments but he has deleted them all.)
Sing F Lau
Brother Matthew, do you think the usage of soul and
spirit synonymous in 1Th 5:23 ALSO?
It is true that in some context, the two words are
synonymous because the context clearly indicate parallelism.
Many people do use 1Th 5:23 to prove that man is
tri-partite.
Sing F Lau
So, man is tri-partite: one part of which is void,
and needed to be filled?
We are talking about the essential constitution of
man: is he body and spirit, or is he body, spirit, and soul?
A bi-partite man filled with the Holy Spirit is
still bi-partite.
Sing F Lau
Did you read this?
Ge 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of
the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a
living soul.
Is this a Greek fable?
What is the Greek fable? Please tell us what it is.
Sing F Lau
Ge 2:7 - And the LORD God formed man of the dust of
the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a
living soul.
Matthew - That same breath that gave the first Adam
his life back in genesis seems to be the same breath that contain spirit and
soul for Adam.
Are you saying the same thing as Gen 2:7?
Scriptures say: that because of the breath of life, man
became a living soul.
You say: the breath of life contains spirit and soul
for Adam.
Are you saying what the Scriptures are saying?
Sing F Lau
@ But then the later statement is contradicting this
verse, and I have to disagree.
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Which statement is contradicting Ecc 11:7? Please elaborate.
Sing F Lau
@ While dead, the Lord preserves our whole body and
spirit... that they may be united again into a glorified living soul.
<<< I disagree with part of this statement, the body is not preserved,
it is shown clearly as corrupting continue unto the dusk.
=======
So, you don't believe in the resurrection of the
body that has turned into dust? If the Lord does not preserve the body unto
resurrection, would there be dust left for the resurrection?
Sing F Lau
No one is saying that the mortal body is preserved
in the sense that it will not rot and decompose and return to the dust!
Nevertheless, the Scriptures plainly declare that
the Lord preserves the body... in that SENSE that the SAME BODY that has
decomposed and returned unto dust shall be resurrected and glorified!
Of course, the glorified body is entirely different
in the sense of its quality, immortal instead of mortal, spiritual instead of
natural, but it is still the same body that shall be resurrected!
Sing F Lau
Scriptures say, "Then shall the dust return to
the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it."
You say, "... and the spirit and soul leaves
this mortal body and return to the Lord for the elected saints.'
God's word says, 'the spirit shall return unto God
who gave it.'
You say, 'the spirit and soul return to the Lord for
the elect saints.'
So, who am I to believe? Please help me.
Sing F Lau
@ 'We should alway believe scripture and NOT man's
concept of creation. '
========
Here it is, what the Scripture says. Do you believe
it?
Ge 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of
the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a
living soul.
Do you need a more explicit statement?
And here is another:
Ec 11:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as
it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Do you need a plainer statement? Where is the mention of your soul?
Sing F Lau
The confusion is here:
If you want to know the constitution of man, go to those
passages that tell us that. Don't go to those passages that speak of the life
of men.
Don't be carried away by SOUND-byte, get the SENSE.
How does Isa 26:9 speak of the constitution of man?
Just because the phrases 'my soul' and 'my spirit' appear in the passage, you
conclude that man is tri-partite?
If that's your conclusion, then what do you want to
do with the clear declaration of Ge 2:7, 'And the LORD God formed man of the
dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man
became a living soul.'
Let me give an illustration. Table salt is sodium
chloride - made up of the elements sodium and chlorine. Some insist that table
salt is made up of three elements: sodium, chlorine and sodium chloride. That
would be a salty fable! <LOL>
Sing F Lau
Matthew, then you have missed the whole point of the
discussion! The whole subject is about the essential constitution of man!
That is why I say... you must know what the subject
of discussion is about, and stick to the subject... otherwise, we are just
loitering around the subject.
What is the problem with the term?
Do you also have a problem with a term like 'trinity'?
Sing F Lau
The term 'trinity' and the meaning of the term are
two different things.
Don't be so fixated with the RC... the subject has
nothing to do with them!!! <LOL>
Do you have a problem with the term 'trinity'? You
seem to have a problem with terms like 'bi-partite' and 'tri-partite.' Or do
you prefer terms like 'dichotomy' or 'trichotomy'?
Terms are necessary short hands in the discussion.
No, no, no. The Scriptures are clearly BI-partite
concerning the essential constitution of man.
Ge 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Sing F Lau
There may be much confusion, and it seems that we are
HARDLY communicating!
1. Man IS IS IS a living soul... because his body
and the spirit of life are in union. That's what Gen 2:7 is saying.
This MEANS that the spirit and the living soul are different and distinct entities.
Isa 26:9 is not speaking of the CONSTITUTION of man.
It speaks of the life-activites of man, where it can be spoken of in terms of
the spirit or the soul, as defined in Gen 2:7.
2. Man, whether dead in sin, or regenerated, is
ALWAYS the same in his essential constitution. So, man dead in sin, and man
quickened unto righteousness are STILL ba-partite in their essential
constitution.
3. The Spirit that the regenerated man has DOES NOT
become part of his essential constitution! A man INDWELT by the Holy Spirit is
still a bi-partite man - his essential constitution has not changed.
I have been saying all these things from the
beginning...
Probably you didn't read them probably.
I hope things are clearer now...
Sing F Lau
It is ok as long as you are CLEAR what I have said.
Whatever you choose to believe, you need to square it
with the Scriptures.
Joh 10:30 I and my Father are one - can you tell us 'are one' in what sense? 'I and my Father' make TWO. So tell us in what sense are the two one. Otherwise, I would know what you want to imply by that passage!
Sing F Lau
Which part of Point #1 you don't agree?
Point #2: Quickening is always accompanied by
adoption, and the adoption is always accompanied by the giving of the Spirit
of adoption!!!!!!! That is basic, brother Matthew!
Point #3: How come even when the person is indwelt
with Holy Spirit it is still bi-partite? Did the Holy Ghost replace the spirit
of that man? If not, there is a now a tri-partite?
1) Holy Ghost 2) Mortal body 3) The spirit of the
person?
The Spirit that fills a child of God does not become
an essential part of that man... the man remains BI-partite.
A Spirit-filled man is still a living soul of spirit and body in union. What do you mean, the Holy Spirit replaces the spirit of the man!!! If the Spirit of God replaces the spirit of man, then where does the replaced spirit go?
Sing F Lau
'We need to maintain every aspect of man to be the
same as it indirectly reflects how we would imply with holy scripture.'
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Elaborate this a bit, Matthew. I don't understand
what you are saying!
Sing F Lau
Matthew, Matthew...
Your words, 'I am trying to explain that Jesus Christ unlike
natural man, has 3-partite (like the term you use).
1) The Father who is God
2) The Word who is God
3) The flesh body this part is fully man.'
=======
I really hope this is ORIGINAL with you, and no one
else believes this fable at all.
Sing F Lau
And just how those two passages prove Jesus being
tri-partite as you defined like this:
'I am trying to explain that Jesus Christ unlike
natural man, has 3-partite (like the term you use).
1) The Father who is God
2) The Word who is God
3) The flesh body this part is fully man.'
