Inquirer
In one of your
articles, you mentioned human responsibility (as in the Divine
Sovereignty/Human Responsibility) as a specific reference to God’s children working
out their own salvation with fear and trembling. So human responsibility is not
in "God's Sovereignty, human responsibility" when we respond with
faith and repentance to accept Christ?
sing
I'm not sure if I
understand your question.
Let me elaborate a
little bit on the subject.
Divine
Sovereignty/Human Responsibility is commonly and popularly understood by the
Reformed/Calvinistic people like this:
- God has
sovereignly provided eternal salvation in Jesus Christ,
- He freely offers
this eternal salvation to all (who are in their native state of death and
condemnation).
- God holds them
responsible for acting in order to appropriate the eternal salvation for
themselves.
Do you see massive moral, rational, scriptural, and theological problems when they place the "human responsibility" in such a context?
In the Bible, the "human responsibility" is placed in the specific context of those whom God has freely (divine sovereignty) bestowed eternal salvation; it is of those whom God HAS sovereignly saved with eternal salvation that God holds responsible for believing in the Lord Jesus Christ; to work out their own salvation (temporal) by doing their Father's will.
It's the responsibility of those whom God has saved by His divine sovereignty that are commanded to repent and believe in Jesus Christ because He is ALREADY their Saviour.
Inquirer
Yes, I was taught
the 1st part in EGM classes. So now I finally know the truth in your 2nd part
above. This is exactly what I was asking
But aren't we to respond with Faith and repentance when we hear the Gospel of Christ and accept Christ? So isn’t this the human responsibility part? And this is equal to your 1st part above?
sing
By the first part do
you mean this?
- God has
sovereignly provided eternal salvation in Jesus Christ,
- He freely offers
this eternal salvation to all (who are in their native state of death and
condemnation).
- God holds them responsible for acting in order to appropriate the eternal salvation for themselves.
Inquirer
Yes. Especially the
third point. But the 2nd point sounds Arminian.
I am saying the third point seems like the God's Sovereignty/Human Responsibility part where an Elect needs to receive Christ in faith and with repentance
If I say the 3rd
point to a Calvinist, he will argue he doesn't preach Arminianism. But to
respond in faith and repentance is the correct way. And since we don't know who are the elects, we evangelise to everyone in the hope of converting some. Then he will
add: Am I doing anything wrong?
sing
The second point: - He freely offers this eternal salvation to all (who are in their native state of death and condemnation).
Yes, the Reformed
people, as well as the Arminians, do believe in the free offer of eternal
salvation to those still dead in trespasses and sins and hold them responsible for doing the necessary to be saved by God. That's what they are doing in their
work of fulfilling the great commission.
If God only offers
eternal salvation to those still dead in trespasses and sins, would anyone be
saved?
The pronoun "them" in the 3rd point refers to those who are still in their native state of trespasses and sins, completely incapable of any spiritual activities because they are spiritually dead.
Who does God hold
responsible to believe that Jesus is their Lord and Saviour? Answer: those whom
He has given to Christ as their Lord and Saviour; those whom He has effectually called to
grace and salvation in Jesus Christ.
Yes, God HAS sovereignly saved an elect through His effectual call - i.e.
justified, regenerated, and adopted, with the Spirit of adoption given to dwell
in him.
God holds His children (the elect whom He HAS MADE CAPABLE OF SPIRITUAL DUTIES through the effectual call to grace and salvation) responsible for working out their own salvation with fear and trembling.
Human responsibility is in the context of God's children, and not natural man generally.
Keep asking until
you understand.
Thanks for your
interest.
Inquirer
OK, supposing I
agree with the above. But the Calvinists will argue that since we dunno who the
elects are, they just share the gospel of Jesus Christ with everyone they come across. I
heard 1 pastor say that we must give the person whom we we trying to evangelize
3 chances whilst continuing to pray for the Holy Spirit to come to them. Do u
find anything wrong with this method?
In this instance, they will say maybe the person is an elect, but God has yet to send the Holy Spirit to regenerate them, so they pray for the Holy Spirit to come to regenerate them. And we continue to pray and minister to them until the Holy Spirit comes to regenerate them. So what's wrong with this?
sing
The issue or the
bone of contention is NOT that anyone knows who is the elect. God alone knows.
The issue is:
- is evangelism the
means to CONVERT God's children (those whom God has sovereignly saved through the
effectual call) to the truths of their salvation,
- OR is evangelism the
means to regenerate those still dead in trespasses and sins?
What is the FUNCTION
of the gospel ministry ordained by God?
Is it the means to
gather His children out of the world into the church of Christ?OR is it the means to
assist God to produce His children for heaven?
They are DIFFERENT
gospels.
sing
".... so v pray
for the Holy Spirit to come to regenerate them. And we continue to pray and
minister to them until the Holy Spirit comes to regenerate them. So what's
wrong with this?"
The Apostles were commissioned to FEED the living, not pray for the dead to be regenerated.
John 21 KJT
15 So when they had
dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more
than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He
saith unto him, Feed my lambs.
16¶He saith to him
again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him,
Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.
17¶He saith unto him
the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because
he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord,
thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him,
Feed my sheep.
Their ministry is to FEED the LIVING out there and gather them into churches.
Luke 10 - KJT
3 Go your ways:
behold, I send you forth as lambs among wolves.
4 Carry neither
purse, nor scrip, nor shoes: and salute no man by the way.
5 And into whatsoever
house ye enter, first say, Peace be to this house.
6 And if the son of
peace be there, your peace shall rest upon it: if not, it shall turn to you
again.
The son of peace is there first by God's divine sovereignty BEFORE the gospel preacher comes to the scene. They were not told to pray that sons of peace come into being!
Mt 28 KJT
19 Go ye therefore,
and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the
Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to
observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you
alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
ONLY those whom God HAS SAVED can be taught through the ministry of the Apostles. Many preachers believe they are sent forth to preach and teach the dead SO THAT the Holy Spirit may do His work of quickening the dead!
