Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:37:06 +0800
To: Ipoh East Church
Subject: FW: some queries & comments
Dear Brothers,
Thank you for your thoughtful queries.
Concerning your queries, I will give some brief thoughts. Please be patient and strive to understand. If you have further queries, don't hesitate to ask.
There is a great difference between justification by God and justification by faith. It is so strange how people are confused between the justification by God and the justification by faith. Surely what God declares about us when we were ungodly condemned enemies (when incapable of believing) and what our faith declares about us when believing in Christ are two very different things. God justifies condemned ungodly sinners legally. Believing in Christ justifies a believer evidentially and experientially. Yet most people would EQUATE the two. If only people would slow down and think a bit, and cease using clichés mindlessly they would begin to see and understand some gospel truth.
It is READILY and HEARTILY admitted by some that faith is an evidence of salvation already bestowed - 1689.11.2. Yet these same people would also insist that faith is the condition for the same salvation. When asked, how could faith be an evidence of salvation and at the same time the condition of salvation, such people are lost for a credible explanation! Faith is a grace of salvation among other graces of salvation. How could the graces of salvation be the condition for salvation is simply beyond my simple mind. Sometimes theological clichés can be great culprits and serious stumbling blocks.
I think the difficulty lies here. Perhaps if we can differentiate the difference between eternal salvation which is of the Lord alone and the salvation which God's children are commanded to work out for themselves, then we would rightly divide the word of truth. Believing is what the justified regenerated and adopted children of God are commanded do to in order to experience the blessings of salvation here and now on earth. Only such has been enabled to believe! Their eternal salvation is by grace alone... nothing they do or fail to do will affect their eternal salvation. I hope each of you can see that it is beyond any shadow of a doubt that ONLY those whom God has bestowed eternal salvation (by free grace legal justification, regeneration and adoption) is able to work out their own salvation, beginning at conversion. "Save yourselves from this perverse generation." Temporal salvation from this perverse generation must be worked out by those whom God has given eternal salvation through the effectual calling unto eternal life.
Our eternal salvation is entirely by grace alone. Our deliverance in this life (i.e. temporal salvation) is conditional upon our obedience - in this sense alone this aspect of salvation is conditioned upon our obedience. There is a salvation which we ourselves must work out. We must believe to save ourselves from this perverse and wicked generation that is governed by the lusts of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and pride of life. Believing is NOT to save us from our eternal condemnation. Believing is a fruit and evidence of our having BEEN SAVED from our just eternal condemnation by the finished work of Christ. Without having been given eternal life by free grace, NO ONE has the spiritual life to believe. Eternal salvation is of the LORD.
Man, regardless of being elect or not elect is appointed to die once - i.e. physical death. Man, whether elect or not, is by nature spiritually dead, absolutely incapable of spiritual activity like believing. Unless one is born again, he CANNOT... no ifs and no buts.... no matter how one can twist and juggle the Scriptures. Read 1689.6.
The incident in Numbers is about the LORD's dealing with His chosen people whom He has unconditionally redeemed out of Egypt, out of a helpless situation of helpless bondage and destruction. It was a picture of a deliverance from eternal condemnation by the sovereign power of the LORD alone, through the blood of the Passover Lamb. The incident was dealing with the murmuring of His ungrateful and unbelieving people. Those who believed and look to the serpent that was lifted up were healed physically, experienced temporal deliverance from the LORD severe chastisement. Sin among God's people has severe timely consequences. [There are sins among the brethren that are sins unto death, i.e. physical death, or ecclesiastical death (excommunication). See 1John 5:16, 1Cor 11:30, James 5:19-20] The incident has nothing to do with eternal salvation. However, their redemption from bondage and destruction by the LORD is pictured through the Passover Lamb in Egypt, a completed and unrepeatable past event.
Believing is evidence of the possession of eternal life - the declaration of John 3:15-16. The passage is not making an offer - believe and you will have eternal life. It makes a grand declaration: whoever believes HAS eternal life. 'HAS' is perfect tense. 'BELIEVETH' is present participle . Having life must precede believing. In believing, we experience deliverance from the timely consequences of our sins and unbelief. Christ's work alone delivered [past tense] us from the eternal consequences of our sins - the just condemnation by the thrice Holy God. Our work of believing, trusting obeying, etc. deliver [simple present tense] us from the temporal consequences of our sins.
I understand that there are Primitive Baptist churches and fellowships in the Philippines, and are still growing, in just the last 10 years. Some of God's people are coming to know the simple gospel truth of free grace. In any case, truth is not measured by its popularity. If it is, then the charismatics and the free-will Arminians would have the truth since they are so popular and multiplying. When people resort to such reasoning, it betrays a weak case. The Scriptures' teaching of the faithful remnant among His people is ever true in every generation. Pure gospel truth can be unpopular - where man plays no part in his salvation - is very unpopular. Anyway, I will inquire someone in the Philippines about the PB there.
I hope the above brief thoughts help to clarify the confusion. Don't hesitate to ask if you have any further question if what I have said make no sense. I am and remain a student of God's word.
Your brother in Christ,
Pastor Lau
-------
on 07.08.05 3:48 PM, Ed wrote:
(Ed attended IEC church with his family, but not member yet)
Dear Pastor Lau,
Sorry for the late reply. Only got to check the mail today. You will be pleased to know that my family and I are back in Ipoh East Church today! May and I had a very long talk last night and we decided to return to the church (like you said, our work there is not done yet). The folks in church welcomed us warmly. We even had all the children come over to the computer center to play games after the service!
The Bible Study session last night was very, very rewarding. We went through the overview of the entire Gospel of Matthew (covering authorship, dating, form, structure, theology, etc.) KK and I had some more time to look through the "justification" issue further and he's now demonstrating a very, very good grasp of the whole thing - seeing that "dikaios" in Greek can mean literally "justification" (made righteous) as well as "authentication/verification/evidencing". This allowed him to understand the wondrous truth of "God justifies the ungodly" and "our faith authenticates/verifies the presence/reality of the Life from God".
KK was rather shocked to see me suddenly turn up in church this morning. "What are you doing here?", he asked. "Haha! I wanted to surprise you!", I answered jokingly. And it was good that I was there also. Lee preached a brilliant presentation of the standard-reformed interpretation of John 3. I said it was a brilliant presentation because... well, it WAS! Except for the fact that it was all wrong. Salvation as conditional - based on faith. Sinners are appointed to die once in life, but not really dead now - so can still respond in faith to grasp salvation of Christ. Example given was the Bronze Serpent episode in Numbers; with the emphasis laid upon the importance of Moses offering the remedy to all but they need to respond by looking at it. Then he went on at length to point out that historically the Particular Baptists were wrong and how their descendants, the Primitive Baptists are now deservingly dwindling in numbers. He deliberately left out! John 3:19-22 and I found that really dishonest handling of Scriptures. May was rather annoyed by then - even she could see that there's really not much difference in that sermon and full-blown Arminianism! Again, it was a brilliant presentation of the standard-reformed view that is alas, wrong in so many ways.
I kept silent throughout.
Loh handed me the CD/MP3 of Noel Espinosa's talks from the camp. Then I proceeded to play guitar with the young people. Loh, Lee and KK than met up to plan out the meeting on the 31st August to study the "Pruning" book together. KK advised me to refrain from joining that meeting. Overall, I am still looked upon as an outsider by Loh and Lee (... and I'm not blaming them!). I'm happy enough that KK would trust me to study this with me, albeit in a private manner. Mel discussed the issue with May also. May could see how confused Mel was over the whole thing. Oh, pastor, they are so much like sheep without a shepherd! She hardly knows HOW to even start studying the whole thing; making comments like "Pastor Lau doesn't believe in faith and evangelism!"
What can I do? I am again reminded that "to those much is given, much is expected". This is my burden and it is no light one - as you too can attest!
As for the mail from Noel Espinosa and your response to it, I'd already read it last month. Forgive me for saying this, but the academia-elitism of Noel is what I detest most in the church today. Is it not enough that the gap between pew and scholar is ever widening today? Where is the disputer among men? Where are the wise men? Where is the philosopher? Where is the scholar? Thanks be to God that He is still the God of the Apostles and Prophets, the God of the littlest babe and the grey-haired illiterate; and foremost, the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who first loved us and redeemed us through His Son. To the foolish and insane, He is still the only Answer. Down with all the pretentious popery of the academia!
Finally, thanks for your kind words and generosity - not least of which is your offer to help me financially. Financial problems are part-and-parcel of my business life. I am thankful that God is gracious and am confident that He will see me through these hard times very soon. I'm in the midst of paying up quite a number of outstanding amount owed to several people and August is a rather unpredictable month for my business (because of the holidays and the exams). Good news is that my staff just informed me that we should be expecting several payments in the coming weeks. I hope that I had not caused you any undue worry over this.
Bro. J K was preaching in Calvary-Jaya PJ this morning. My dad met up with him. Told him that I'm now in the RBC and meeting up with you regularly. He remembered you. Jeffrey is a good person to talk to on the KJV issue. He's got lots more resources on this issue now that he's with the Dean Burgon Society. I will try to send you my own research very soon; along with the handouts that we used in the Saturday night studies for your review.
Your brother and friend,
Ed.
_____________
From: sing
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 20:01:56 +0800
To: Ed
Subject: Re: Justification Clarified!
Dear Brother Ed,
Thanks for your mail.
It heartens my heart to read that you and the family assembled with the folks at IEC. Assembling with them is itself a testimony. Not assembling with them may stumble some. At the moment, I don't know if there is any alternative church you would feel comfortable with.
I rejoice with you to see KK progressing to understand the various facets of justification. It is so strange how people could be confused justification by God and justification by faith. Surely what God declares about us when we were ungodly condemned enemies and what our faith declares about us when believing in Christ are two very different things. One is legal, the other is evidential and experiential, yet folks would EQUATE them. If only people slow down and think a bit, and cease using clichés mindlessly they would begin to understand some gospel truth.
Lee admitted before that faith is evidence of salvation. Then I asked, how could faith be evidence of salvation and at the same time the condition of salvation? He just kept quiet! Our eternal salvation is entirely by grace alone. Our enjoyment of the temporal blessings in this life is conditional upon our obedience. There is a salvation which we ourselves must work out. We must believe to save ourselves from this perverse and wicked generation - governed by the lusts of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and pride of life. Believing is NOT to save us from our eternal condemnation. Believing is a fruit and evidence of our having BEEN SAVED from our just eternal condemnation by the finished work of Christ. Eternal salvation is of the LORD.
Sinners are appointed to die once - that speaks of physical death. All sinners are by nature spiritually dead, absolutely incapable of spiritual activity like believing. Unless one is born again, he CANNOT... no ifs and no buts.... no matter how one can twist and juggle the Scriptures.
The incident in Numbers is about the LORD's dealing with His chosen people whom He has unconditionally redeemed out of Egypt. It was dealing with the murmuring of His ungrateful and unthankful people. Those who believed and look to the serpent that was lifted up were healed physically, experienced temporal deliverance from His severe chastisement. The incident has nothing to do with eternal salvation. It is not a fit illustration of eternal salvation. Believing is evidence of the possession of eternal life - the declaration of John 3:15-16. The passage is not making an offer - believe and you will have eternal life. It makes a grand declaration: whoever believes HAS eternal life. 'HAS' is perfect tense. 'BELIEVETH' is simple present tense (participle). Having life must precede believing.
I understand that there are not a few Primitive Baptist churches in the Philippines, and still growing, in just the last 10 years. More and more of God's people are coming to know the simple gospel truth of free grace. In any case, truth is not measured by its popularity or not. If it is, then the charismatics and the free-will Arminians have the truth!!! The RCs have the truth. When people resort to such reasoning, it betrays the DESPERATENESS of their position. The Scriptures' teaching of the faithful remnant among His people is ever true in every generation.
No, you have not caused me any undue worry about your financial situation. It is part and parcel of life and it is brothers' privilege to assist when needs arise. I have been helped before many times. And there are brothers who are ready to help also. People have assisted us with soft loans to pay off our housing loans... when the time was hard.
Looking forward to seeing you and your family in Penang.
Ever thankful for your fellowship in the gospel of grace in this lonely land.
I remain your brother and servant of Christ,
Pastor Lau
==================
From: sing
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 21:51:23 +0800
To: IEC
Subject: FW some figures on the Primitive Baptists in the Philippines
Dear brethren,
A brother asked me about a comment [made by Lee in his sermon] about the Primitive Baptists churches in the US dwindling and dying. I do not know about the situation so I asked a brother in the Philippines, who was formerly a RB, who knows Pastor Noel Espinosa well. His response is pasted below.
----------
sing wrote:
Dear brother Ron,
Someone asked me a comment that the PB churches are dying.
I heard that the Lord has raised up some PB in the Philippines.
Do you have a figure of the constituted PB in the Philippines?
What was their background? How many RB churches are there in the
Philippines?
I would be thankful for some reliable figures so that we may be informed.
brother sing
-----
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:51:40 +0100 (BST)
To: sing
Subject: Re: some figures on the Primitive Baptists in the Philippines
Dear Sing,
Reformed Baptists in the Philippines are just a small group - with its beginning in 1979. They are very good in gathering ministers in their Annual Pastors Conference.(they only look big in the Pictures for fund-raising)
The last conference was attended by around 200 ministers and preachers from different denomination( charismatic, evangelicals, full-gospel, and different baptist camps, etc.). Most of these people are my friends, since I came from different denomination before I embraced the reformed baptist perspective and distinctives. They are able to encourage ministers to come because of the FREE BOOKS that they will get from the conference.
I will give you the webpage for you to see the figure of the REFORMED BAPTIST IN THE PHILIPPINES. The REBAP website http://www.info.com.ph/~btellis/rebap.htm list about 27 RB churches: 6 assoc. members, 5 being considered for membership, 16 others in loose fellowship.
NOW, MY PERSONAL ASSESMENT IS THIS: REBAP MINISTERS ONLY LOVE TO READ BOOKS AND ATTEND SEMINARS. In fact, they idolize your classmate, Pastor NOEL ESPINOSA. And no doubt they are more on intellectualism. Pastor Noel is a good lecturer, but I noticed that he is good only in quoting Theologians in the Past. But, speaking of proper exegesis of the text there will be some problems.
Now, the Primitive Baptist in the Philippines in my Directory: there are around 120 churches and fellowship under the "white unto harvest list". The first church was constituted in 1993.
The exact figures AS OF MARCH 2004, are as follows:
CONSTITUTED CHURCHES 45
FELLOWSHIPS 72
TOTAL BAPTIZED BRETHREN 2,000
In our church we have 3 ordained Elders and 3 recognized Preachers.
We are about to constitute one of our 6 outreaches this coming 3rd Sunday.
We believe that a NEW TESTAMENT CHURCH must be Autonomous.
I HOPE THIS INFORMATION WILL BE A GREAT HELP. PLEASE FEEL FREE TO ASK ANY QUESTION IN PRIVATE.
RONALD
