A little exchange on the faith of Christ...
Manny
Manny
When studying the subject of faith it is well to consider that there are at least two aspects of faith. There is the faith that is "the gift of God," which comes in regeneration or if you prefer, new birth, and there is that faith which is exercised when the born again person simply believes God. To believe God is to believe His word absolutely and with out the slightest equivocation. There is a difference in believing in God and believing God. Thank about it.
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Ballas
Copied to share Brother Manny.
Sing
Elder Manny, you have overlooked the faith that really matter, even the faith of Christ.
Elder Manny, you have overlooked the faith that really matter, even the faith of Christ.
Romans 3:22 KJV — Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Manny
Brother Sing I have never been able to reconcile the idea that one with perfect knowledge would need faith. I think that "faith" in the above text, refers to "faith that comes from Jesus Christ". Christ (God) is the originator of our faith.
(sing: There is no reconciliation needed when the word of truth is rightly divided.)
(sing: There is no reconciliation needed when the word of truth is rightly divided.)
Sing
Elder Manny, look at the second primary meaning of faith below:
Outline of Biblical Usage
I. conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the NT of a conviction or belief respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervour born of faith and joined with it
A. relating to God
- the conviction that God exists and is the creator and ruler of all things, the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ
B. relating to Christ
- a strong and welcome conviction or belief that Jesus is the Messiah, through whom we obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom of God
C. the religious beliefs of Christians
D. belief with the predominate idea of trust (or confidence) whether in God or in Christ, springing from faith in the same
II. fidelity, faithfulness
the character of one who can be relied on.
It is the faith of Christ, NOT the faith that comes from Him, (faith is a grace worked in a child of God by the indwelling Spirit. it is a fruit of the Spirit - that much is clear); it is Christ's character of FIDELITY, of FAITHFULNESS in executing the work of redemption and securing the eternal salvation for His people.
John 17:4
“I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.” (This declares the faith of Christ, His character of faithfulness.)
Rev 19:11
“And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.”
(This too declares the faith of Christ, His character of faithfulness.)
(This too declares the faith of Christ, His character of faithfulness.)
Manny
Dear Brother, I didn't post this for debate, but only for consideration.
Dear Brother, I didn't post this for debate, but only for consideration.
Sing
Dear Elder Manny, I'm not debating you or anyone. I'm stating the faith of Christ that is precious to me. I had your kind of understanding on faith when I was a Calvinist!
Dear Elder Manny, I'm not debating you or anyone. I'm stating the faith of Christ that is precious to me. I had your kind of understanding on faith when I was a Calvinist!
Buddy
Sing F Lau How is what Brother Manny stated the language of a Calvinist? A true Calvinist believes that all of the elect will "come to faith in Christ". Brother Manny clearly distinguished between faith as a consequence of regeneration and faith exercised when we believe the gospel, trust God, etc.
Sing F Lau How is what Brother Manny stated the language of a Calvinist? A true Calvinist believes that all of the elect will "come to faith in Christ". Brother Manny clearly distinguished between faith as a consequence of regeneration and faith exercised when we believe the gospel, trust God, etc.
Sing
When I was a Calvinist (whether I was a true Calvinist, I know not!), I was taught that the faith of Christ is the faith that comes from Christ. Elder Manny is a renowned PB, how can he ever be a Calvinist? I said when I was a Calvinist, I believe such a notion. Maybe such is ALSO the belief of some PBs. Like I said, the faith that matters, even the faithfulness of Christ, is completely forgotten.
Buddy
Elder Manny, I agree with you concerning Romans 3:22. "The righteousness of God without the law" (v. 21) implies that our faith (confidence) of being just (righteous) before God is based on something other than the law. We are legally, i.e. actually justified by "grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus". (v. 24) "Justified by faith", however, means that I think I'm justified because I believe Jesus "bare my sins is his own body on the tree" (1 Peter 2:24). "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law." (Romans 3:28).
(sing: note: we were LEGALLY justified by the blood and righteousness of Christ on the cross; we were VITALLY/PERSONALLY justified by the grace of God through the redemption that is in Christ; we are EXPERIENTIALLY justified by faith in Jesus Christ.)
Sing
Romans 3:22 KJV — Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
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A few observations:
A few observations:
1. The righteousness of God - the righteousness of God's provision.
2. The righteousness of God's provision is by the faithfulness of Christ in rendering full and perfect obedience to the whole law God. (Sin is the transgression of the law of God; righteousness is the obedience to the law of God)
3. This righteousness of God by God's own provision through the faithfulness of Christ is freely applied to each elect in vital justification. (Legal justification is by the righteousness and blood of Christ; at the cross. Vital justification is freely by the grace of God.)
4. Vital justification by God's free grace enables and makes believing possible.
- "...all them that believe"/the believing ones are so because the righteousness of God has been freely applied to them.
Good night. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.