Things New and Old

Ancient truths revealed in the Scriptures are often forgotten, disbelieved or distorted, and therefore lost in the passage of time. Such ancient truths when rediscovered and relearned are 'new' additions to the treasury of ancient truths.

Christ showed many new things to the disciples, things prophesied by the prophets of old but hijacked and perverted by the elders and their traditions, but which Christ reclaimed and returned to His people.

Many things taught by the Apostles of Christ have been perverted or substituted over the centuries. Such fundamental doctrines like salvation by grace and justification have been hijacked and perverted and repudiated by sincere Christians. These doctrines need to be reclaimed and restored to God's people.

There are things both new and old here. "Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things"
2Ti 2:7.

Sunday, December 26, 2010

But how did God so love? John 3:16

Have you heard the gospel –
the good news of God’s powerful and gracious work
of saving dead condemned sinners?

你听到福音了吗? —
—关于上帝那强而有力的 施恩圣工和慈爱
来拯救灵性死亡的罪人?

(Chinese translation by Sister Joey Tan)

Behold what manner of love...
看哪 ! 这是何等的爱


For God so loved the world,
that he gave his only begotten Son,
that whosoever believeth in him
should not perish, but have everlasting life.

神爱世人, 甚至将他的他独生子赐给他们,
凡信他的,不至灭亡,而是已拥有永 生了


這就是愛


“ 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God. Jn 3

“上帝差他儿子降世,并不是要定世人的罪,乃是要藉著他而得救.信他的人,罪已经被赦 免;而不信他的,罪已经定了,因為他不信神獨生子的名. 光来到世間, 世人因自己的行为是恶的,不爱光,倒爱黑暗.定他们的罪就在此。 凡作恶的便恨光,并不来就光, 以免他的行为曝露在光亮中。但那些行真理的人必来就 光,要显明他所行的是靠神而行"


But how did God so love?
但神如何爱世人?

1. God so loved...
He loved the world that lies in spiritual darkness and death, a world in rebellion and enmity against Him as God and Creator.
神爱世人...
他爱那些卧在属灵黑暗和死亡里的世 人,那些叛逆,并与上帝--造物主为敌的人

2. God so loved...
He loved the utterly un-loveable and deserving of just condemnation; He loved the sons of disobedience and children of wrath.
神爱世人⋯
他爱那些完全不可爱的人和应受他的公 义审判的世人;他爱那些悖逆之子和可怒之子。

3. God so loved...
He loved such sinners with an immense and immeasurable love, sacrificing His most precious Son for the most undeserving and ill-deserving sinners.
神爱世人⋯
他以无可比拟以及不可测度的爱,牺牲 了他最宝爱的儿子,来拯救那些不值得和极不配挽救的罪人。

4. God so loved...
He sent His only begotten Son Jesus Christ to save the justly condemned, the undeserving and ill-deserving sinners that they should not PERISH in the lake of fire..
神爱世人⋯
他差遣他唯一的儿子,主耶稣基督来挽 救那些本该被定罪的,不值得挽救的, 极不配得着拯救的罪人,以免他们在地狱中灭亡。

5. God so loved...
He sent His only begotten Son that He might live the perfect and sinless life for His people and to secure the perfect righteousness for them. God freely provided this perfect righteousness for His unrighteous condemned people.
神爱世人⋯
他差送他唯一的儿子到这世上,让他代 替他的子民过着完美和无罪的生活,为他的子民争 取完美的公义。神不惜代价的为他罪恶的子民提供 了这个完美的公义。

6. God so loved...
He sent His only begotten Son to suffer and to die in the place of His people to bear away God’s holy wrath and just condemnation upon them that they deserve for all their sins and unrighteousness.
神爱世人...
他差送他唯一的儿子来到这世上受苦, 代替他的子民来受死,并承担了他子民们的罪行和不义,免了神的圣怒与他们应受的惩罚。

7. God so loved...
He resurrected His only begotten Son from the dead so that He might conquer death and destroy the power of death upon His people. He exalted His Son to the highest power, glory and majesty.
神爱世人...
他叫他的儿子从死里复活,战胜了死亡的权势并且毁灭了他子民身上的死亡势力。他以至 高的权力,荣耀和威严来高举他的儿子。

8. God so loved...
He imputed Christ's righteousness by free grace to His people while they were yet dead in sin and in enmity against Him. God justifies them FREELY by His grace when they have no ability to believe, being dead in trespasses and sins. 
神爱世人...
当他的子民们还死在过犯中,并和他为敌时,他施恩给他们,把主耶稣基督的义记算在他们身上。白白的使他们称义。

9. God so loved...
He gives eternal life to His people while they are dead in sin through the regenerating work of His Spirit and adopts them as His children. “Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God.”
神爱世人...
当他的子民们还死在过犯中时,他藉着圣灵的工作,使他们重生,赐给他们永生,并认领他们为他的儿女。 “你看天父赐给我们的是何等的慈爱,使我们得称为神的儿女

10. God so loved...
He gives eternal life to His people SO THAT they may believe the gospel, the good news of what God has done in Jesus Christ to save His people. ‘Whoever believes HAS eternal life.” This is grace indeed! (Don’t believe the popular LIE that a spiritually dead sinner can believe in order to have eternal life. Life must precede the acts of life. Spiritual life precedes spiritual activities - basic and elementary.
神爱世人...
他赐给他的子民永生,让他们可以相信福音,相信神藉着在主耶稣基督里所成就的一切工
永生了"。这得确是恩典! (不要相信,一个灵性死亡的罪人能相信福音而赚得永生的谎话。 有生
命先才能行生命的行为, 有属灵的生命先前才能行属灵的活动)

11. God so loved...
He nourishes and trains His children to live godly and holy through the ministry of the word in the context of NT church. He preserves His children in their eternal salvation.
神爱世人⋯
他通过教会,藉着他的话语,就是圣经。来喂养,并教导他的儿女们,如何过着一个圣洁和敬虔的生活,使到他们能够保存在他的救恩里。

12. God so loved...
He shall resurrect and gather all His children to dwell with Him in the eternal bliss of the new heaven and new earth after the Great Judgment Day.
神爱世人⋯
他会在大审判那一日复活他的子民,并招集他们与他同住在新天地,在天堂过着永恒,幸福的日子。

Jesus Christ said, “I give them eternal life... My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.”
主耶稣基督说,“我赐给他们永生。。。我的羊听到我的声音,我也认识他们,他们也跟随我。“

Do you know anything of this amazing love of God in Jesus Christ? Do you believe this good news of God’s love in Jesus Christ? A child of God believes this good news of salvation. Christ’s sheep hear His voice! Do you? Come and join us to worship and serve Him who so loved us.

你是否晓得在主耶稣基督里那奇妙的爱呢?你是否相信神如何透过主耶稣基督来拯救他的子民的好消息呢? 神的儿女们都会相信关乎这救恩的福音。基督的羊会听到他的呼唤声!你是否也听到他的呼唤声呢? 来与我们一起敬拜并侍奉那爱我们的神吧。

The good news is: “whoever believes HAS eternal life.’
It is not. “whoever will believe shall have eternal life.’
令人雀耀的好消息是:"那相信的已经拥有永生了,
而不是凡相信的方能得着永生.“
========

p/s

A brother said:
Below is an exegesis of one arminian friend who advocate the conditionality of John 3:16.
____________

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

"WHOSOEVER believeth in him . . . HAVE everlasting life." Is the grammar correct? WRONG! Or worse yet . . .

"WHOSOEVER believeth in him SHOULD . . . HAS everlasting life." Is the grammar correct? WRONG!

To be declarative the verse should read -

"WHOSOEVER believeth in him . . . HAS everlasting life." Is the grammar correct? Absolutely yes! The only problem is "HAVE" is used in the verse and not "HAS."

This is what the verse actually says:

"WHOSOEVER believeth in him SHOULD . . . HAVE everlasting life." Is the grammar correct? Absolutely yes!. The last part of the verse, therefore, is clearly CONDITIONAL.
___________

I would like to hear what you have to say on this. Grammatically, it seems accurate and right, but I would like to get your inputs.

Thanks.


Sing F Lau
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
==========

1. 'whosoever believeth in him should not perish'
2. 'whosoever believeth in him have everlasting life'

'Whosoever' is not necessarily singular. 'Whosoever' is often used collectively, meaning 'some of all types' or 'all'. That explain why it is followed by the verb 'have' and not 'has'.

'believeth' is present active PARTICIPLE, i.e the believing, functioning like a verbal noun. 'Whosoever believeth' means 'all the believing'... therefore followed by 'have'.

'Should' is a modal verb related to 'perish', indicating the consequence of believing.

The consequence of believing is should not perish.
The consequence of believing is not have eternal life.

Possession of everlasting life is the reason there are believing ones. Believing is because of the possession of everlasting life.

Believing is OBVIOUSLY an activity of the everlasting life.

ONLY an insane man denies that life must precede the activities of that life. Believing is an activity of spiritual life.


Dan
Thank you brother Sing.
Is it not that "BELIEVETH" is a singular verb which stands for the modern form "believes" ?


Sing F Lau
‎'believeth' is a participle.

Parsing information:
Tense: Present
Voice: Active
... Mood: Participle

participle |ˈpärtəˌsipəl|
noun Grammar
a word formed from a verb (e.g., going, gone, being, been) and used as an adjective (e.g., working woman, burned toast) or a noun (e.g., good breeding).



The End and the Means Appointed to that End- what are they?

A helping hand doesn't contribute in any way to the being of the boy.
But a helping hand contributes to his well-being.
Do you appreciate the distinction?

The End Decreed and the Means Appointed to That End

Sain posted this:
‎"In every instance where God has decreed an end, He has also decreed every means to that end. The One who decreed the salvation of His elect also decreed to work faith in them." - A.W. Pink

Sing F Lau
The end decreed and every means decreed to that specific end must necessarily be in the same category. The end decreed is the ETERNAL SALVATION of God's elect, and the means decreed towards the ETERNAL SALVATION must not be confused and mistaken with the TEMPORAL SALVATION desired for God's children and the means PROVIDED to be used for the TEMPORAL SALVATION of God's children.

It is true... the indwelling Spirit works all the saving graces in each and EVERY child of God (i.e ALREADY bestowed with eternal salvation by grace through the finished work of Jesus Christ) including the grace of faith. This includes the elect infants that die in infancy... as well as those that are mentally challenged, and all others who do not have the opportunity to hear the gospel.

However it is erroneous to then conclude that every one of God's children will hear the gospel and manifest that grace of faith worked in him by the indwelling Spirit of God.

The grace of faith worked within a child of God REQUIRES the gospel ministry as the instrument to draw forth that grace of faith worked within him.

Faith comes by hearing the gospel. So many believe that regeneration by hearing! Without the gospel ministry, there would be no manifestation of faith.

There are God's children who never lived old enough to hear or understand the gospel of their eternal salvation by grace.

There are God's children who do not have the mental capacity to hear or comprehend the gospel of the eternal salvation.

There are also God's children who are not reached with the gospel ministry, but live as those who fear God and work righteousness (because they were regenerated by God directly and without gospel means), and died and go to heaven.

There are also God's children who are reached with FALSE gospel, and are not converted to the true gospel of Jesus Christ. And there are many such in each generation.

There are also God's children who are reached with the true gospel, and are converted to vastly different degree to the gospel of Jesus Christ, some very little, others much more.

God DECREED the eternal salvation of His elect, and He has INDEED also decreed every means to that end, i.e. eternal salvation. Whatever is NECESSARY for eternal salvation has been decreed by God towards that specific end. Amen and amen.

BUT gospel conversion is MOST CERTAINLY not one of them... otherwise, EACH and EVERY elect shall be CONVERTED, and shall be converted in exactly the same manner and to the same extent.

Sing F Lau
For the eternal salvation of God's elect, certain things has indeed been decreed, and these are stated plainly in the Scriptures:

"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be ...the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Here are the activities that have been decreed by God for the eternal glorification of ALL His elect. Eternal glory is the end decreed, the means to that end are also decreed

Please note that the divine activities stated in the passage here are all by God's free and sovereign grace: predestination, calling, justification and glorification are solely and wholly by the free and sovereign of God. Those acted upon in these divine activities are completely passive, and those acted upon in these divine activities are EQUALLY ACTED upon - they are ALL EQUALLY predestinated, called, justified, and glorified.

With this passage also, the Calvinists are confused and obtuse too! Why? They insisted that the justification here is justification by faith through the gospel ministry This is simply not possible, not true. Why?

Note first of all that the justification spoken of here APPLIES to EVERY SINGLE ELECT, every one predestinated unto eternal life. This passage speaks of that which is true of EVERY SINGLE ELECT, and that WHICH EQUALLY true of EVERY SINGLE ELECT.

The justification here simply cannot be the justification by faith, because there are God's children who are simply incapable of faith. PERIOD.

The question may be asked, why is regeneration not mentioned? Quite simple: application of the righteousness of life in justification necessarily include the impartation of eternal life based on the righteousness of life applied personally. Justification is the justification of life!

"17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto JUSTIFICATION of LIFE."

With the justification of life, eternal glory is already GUARANTEED.

Anything that involves human instrument is not under consideration... like the gospel call leading to conversion and justification by faith, and sanctification through the gospel ministry. These things are vital and important, but they PLAY no role in the eternal salvation of God's elect. These things are very useful for the well being of God's children while here on earth. And God's children experience them to vastly different measures and degrees!

Why? Because it was never decreed or fixed by God. How much a child of God is gospelly converted DEPENDS to a great degree upon many human factors.

Milne
Sing - in Romans 5 & 8, Paul is talking about justification through faith alone. It is absurd to say otherwise. And Paul himself is very seriously concerned with the necessity of people hearing the preaching of the gospel in order to be saved.

Romans 10:13-17
13 For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” 14 How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15 And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

What you say is very wrong, Sing, and as you attempt to defend your doctrine of undetectable regeneration (as opposed to the Biblical doctrine of regeneration, where it is always accompanied by repentance and faith) gets worse and worse every time I see comments by you. If what you say were true... and regenerate people might believe the gospel, they might believe a false gospel, they might believe no gospel... how could letters like 1 John ever be written, for example, where the evidences of regeneration are evident to those who observe? How could James say what he says in James 1? How could Peter say what he says in 1 Peter 1? Last time, you said that "this word is the good news that was preached to you" in 1 Peter 1:25 really meant that Jesus invisibly applied regeneration to the recipients of the letter apart from the preaching of the gospel. Have you come up with a better way to get around the clear teaching of 1 Peter 1, or do you intend to continue to obstinately refuse correction from the Scriptures and attempt to spread erroneous teaching regarding regeneration?

Sing F Lau
Do you realize that Apostle Paul speaks of different aspects of justification in Romans? Probably not! When Apostle Paul marshaled Abraham to prove his point, what justification is he trying to prove to the Jews?

Please tell, was Abraham a justified man by God before Gen 15:1-6, or was he still a condemned man up to that point? What is the justification spoken of in Gen 15:1-6?

When Apostle Paul speak of justification by the free grace of God through the redemption of Jesus Christ, and then he speaks of the justification by your believing act, is he speaking of the SAME justification?

Sing F Lau
Here is the 1Pet 1:25 passage:
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
24 ¶ For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away:
25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.
======

What/who brought about the new birth? Scriptures or the life-giving Word of God, Christ? Answer this to your own satisfaction.

Just what/who is the word of God in verse 23, that is described as incorruptible, lives and abides for ever?

Scriptures informs me that the written word of God has so often be corrupted by MANY men! 2Co 2:17 "For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ. What more with so many modern perversions of the written word of God!"

I know One who is incorruptible, and beyond defilement, and who lives and abides forever! And His name is, the word of God. "And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God" Re 19:13.

What alternative are you left with - Just what/who is the word of God in verse 23

And between verse 24 and 25, what or who is being contrasted with flesh and man? Is the contrast between personal being (man) and thing (written Scriptures), or between personal being (man) and personal being (the word of God as in John 1:1)? Pick your choice and remain consistent.

To what does "the word" (v25b) refer back in the preceding?

In the statement, "And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you" there are three separate matters or entities:
- 'the word': this is the heart and subject of the gospel. Who/what is the heart and subject of the gospel? Is it the written Scriptures that is the heart and subject of the gospel, or is it A PERSON who is the heart and subject of the gospel?
- the gospel as revealed and contained in the written Scriptures.
- the gospel ministry, the act of declaring the gospel message.

You have a good day. It's nearly midnight here.

Milne
Ok, Sing, I just figured out what your problem is. You gave it away at the end of your second comment:

"Anything that involves human instrument is not under consideration... like the gospel call leading to conversion and justification by faith, and sanctification through the gospel ministry. These things are vital and important, but they PLAY no role in the eternal salvation of God's elect. These things are very useful for the well being of God's children while here on earth. And God's children experience them to vastly different measures and degrees!"

"Why? Because it was never decreed or fixed by God. How much a child of God is gospelly converted DEPENDS to a great degree upon many human factors."

You're so far off in the first paragraph you wrote there - as justification by faith is nothing less than essential to the eternal salvation of God's elect - because of the false dichotomy you're operating under in the second paragraph. You say there are things that were never decreed or fixed by God. Such is nonsense. All is decreed and fixed by God, including things that involve human instruments, human factors, etc. You're making the Arminian error (I expect you to be offended by that accusation, of course) of assuming that divine sovereignty can't co-exist with human responsibility, so in your attempt to protect the doctrine of God's sovereignty over salvation, you have to divide things into two categories - on one hand, we have everything God is sovereign over, and nothing in that category can involve human instruments or human factors, and on the other hand, we have everything else, that which God did not decree or fix, and that category is all dependent on human instruments and human factors. In the first category, you have 100% divine sovereignty and 0% human responsibility, and in the second category, you have 0% divine sovereignty ("it was never decreed or fixed by God") and 100% human responsibility. The Scriptures say that God saves his elect without fail. So you put that in the first category. And the the Scriptures say that people are responsible to preach the gospel and believe the gospel. So you put that in the second category.

That is wrong, though. Like it or not, God is sovereign over all. That means that he is sovereign over the preaching of his Word, he is sovereign over the believing of his Word and the rejection of his Word... he is sovereign over whether any particular person is converted, over how much any particular Christian grows in the faith, etc. He is sovereign, having decreed and fixed from eternity, everything involving every human factor that has ever existed or will ever exist. Hence, there is no reason to create a category of "things that were never decreed or fixed by God." When it comes to the category of things that involve human instruments and human factors... we have both 100% divine sovereignty and 100% human responsibility.

Justification is an act of God's free grace, yes... but that doesn't mean then that God does not work through secondary means (such as the preaching of the gospel and faith in the gospel) when he sovereignly and graciously accomplishes his work of justification.

Sing F Lau
There is no problem at my end. I can show you that the big problem lies in your own bosom, brother. You nurture a FATAL ERROR and yet are oblivious of it.

You declared, "justification by faith is nothing less than essential to the eternal salvation of God's elect." Let us suppose that this is true, then you must admit that WITHOUT faith, i.e. the act of believing and resting in Jesus Christ and His righteousness, there would be NO eternal salvation, no ifs and no buts.

Do you admit this? The law of non-contradiction requires this, does it not?

Go figure out the implications of your fatal statement of error. You have just excluded some elect from their eternal salvation. (Some elect are incapable of being called out by the gospel preaching.)

Then also, another BIG problem of yours is this: you fail (or may be incapable, or completely ignorant of the biblical distinction) to distinguish the justification by God's free grace and the justification by the believing act of God's children.

This is on my wall presently: go and take a look at it here.
=======
"Calvinists are confused, and obtuse too. "Faith thus receiving and resting on Christ and His righteousness, is the alone instrument of justification; yet it is not alone in the person justified, but ever accompanied with all other saving graces, and is no dead faith, but worketh by love." They read this and conclude that their faith is the mean to get them justified by God. Nothing can be further from the truth."
===========
There is no need to be offended. I have offered many reasons to demonstrate the charge.

Sing F Lau
You will probably quote this to support your view: "justification by faith is nothing less than essential to the eternal salvation of God's elect."

"Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified."
==========

With this passage also, the Calvinists are confused and obtuse!
Why? They insisted that the justification here is justification by faith!

This is simply not possible, not true. Why?

Note first of all that the justification spoken of here APPLIES to EVERY SINGLE ELECT, every one predestinated unto eternal life. This passage speaks of that which is true of EVERY SINGLE ELECT, and that WHICH EQUALLY true of EVERY SINGLE ELECT.

The justification here simply cannot be the justification by faith, because there are God's children who are simply incapable of faith - the act of believing and resting in Jesus Christ and His righteousness. PERIOD.

Next, please note that the divine activities here are all by His free and sovereign graces... predestination, calling, justification and glorification are all by the free and sovereign of God. Those acted upon in these divine activities are completely passive, and those acted upon in these divine activities are EQUALLY ACTED upon - they are ALL EQUALLY predestinated, called, justified, and glorified.

Why is regeneration not mentioned? Quite simple: application of the righteousness of life in justification necessarily include the impartation of eternal life based on the righteousness of life applied personally. Justification is the justification of life!

"17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto JUSTIFICATION of LIFE."

Anything that involves human instrument is not under consideration... like the gospel call leading to conversion and justification by faith, and sanctification through the gospel ministry. Why? Because not every child of will experience these temporal things.

And those who have, they experience them to vastly different measures and degrees!

Despite these OBVIOUS facts, the Calvinists continue to insist that the passage speaks of justification by their faith!

Milne
So... what was the substance in that response?

1. I still maintain that every single one of the elect is regenerated at some time or another in their life, and the consequence of the regeneration is faith and repentance every single time. Every single one of the elect is justified through faith alone by God's free grace. And I also maintain that no elect are excluded by that statement. I'm almost scared to ask what Biblical evidence you would provide to support the idea that there are some elect that are thereby excluded from salvation by this view... I don't want to see what passage of Scripture you will tortously interpret and stand on its head next!

Have you ever read any books on hermeneutics? Or listened to some lectures on it? You could benefit from that... plus logic. Check out aomin.org, there are many articles and essays by James White there, and his works are very useful in learning how to properly interpret the Scriptures as well as how to think clearly.

2. The justification by God's free grace is the justification by the believing act of God's children. These are not two different justifications. That is the justification that Paul is talking about in Romans 3, the justification he is talking about in Romans 4, the justification he is talking about in Romans 5, and the justification he is talking about in Romans 8. It's also the justification spoken of in Philippians 3 and in Galatians. The summary in the Westminster Shorter Catechism is a sufficient description of the Biblical doctrine:

Q. 33. What is justification?
A. Justification is an act of God’s free grace,[91] wherein he pardoneth all our sins,[92] and accepteth us as righteous in His sight,[93] only for the righteousness of Christ imputed to us,[94] and received by faith alone.[95]
[91] Romans 3:24. Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
[92] Romans 4:6-8. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. 2 Corinthians 5:19. To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
[93] 2 Corinthians 5:21. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
[94] Romans 4:6, 11. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works.... And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also: Romans 5:19. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
[95] Galatians 2:16. Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. Philippians 3:9. And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith.


Sing F Lau
Thanks for regurgitating all the old familiar stuff.
Will do you good if you restudy the Scriptures a bit.

Supposing a man FREELY credited a $1b to your account and paid your debt while you were a condemned and declared bankrupt. And someone brought the good news to you. And you believed the good news of the FREE gracious act, and by faith you went to the bank to draw on the money.

It would be SCANDALOUS and TREACHEROUS of you to claim that your believing the good news and going to the bank caused the gift to be freely credited to your account!

Yet so many insist that... they are justified by God through their faith!

Sing F Lau
Q. 33. What is justification?
A. Justification is an act of God’s free grace,[91] wherein he pardoneth all our sins,[92] and accepteth us as righteous in His sight,[93] only for the righteousness of Christ imputed to us,[94] and received by ...faith alone.[95]
========

Do you understand what it means when it is said that justification is an act of God's FREE grace?

Do you understand that justification as an act of God's FREE grace is a DISTINCT and SEPARATE and independent act from that of the justified's act in receiving it?

When was Abraham justified by God's free grace?

When did Abraham receive it by faith?

Tell us if you know. Thanks.

Milne
Romans 5:1 - "Therefore, since we have been justified by faith..."
Scandalous!

Philippians 3:9 - "...not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that d...epends on faith..."
Treacherous!

Besides, I already presented the definition of justification from the Westminster Shorter Catechism, which you missed the point of... in your illustration, faith would be the transfer of funds maybe, or possibly the signing of the form approving the transfer of funds into the account, but not the money itself (Christ's righteousness) or the giver of the money (God, by his grace).

Consider a different example. A rich man marries a poor lady. When they marry, she becomes rich. Her marriage vows are not the money itself, neither do they give the money. But they are the means whereby she becomes rich. The analogy breaks down, certainly, but it is in some measure analogous to what the apostle means in the above passages by his repeated references to faith and the role it plays in our justification. Our justification, too, like marriage, occurs in a covenantal framework... Jesus freely and graciously makes his covenant with the people chosen by his Father, and we enter into the covenant and receive the blessings of it (such as justification and forgiveness of sins) by faith (which is neither a meritorious work nor the grounds of our justification, but the means whereby we are justified). This is not opposed to or separate from justification by grace, for consider what Paul says about the role of faith and grace in justification in Romans 4:16 - "That is why it depends on faith, in order that the promise may rest on grace..." Faith is trusting the promise of another, trusting in the works and merit of another, our Savior, Jesus Christ.

Romans 3:21 But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. 26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

You will notice that this passage here - the beginning of Paul's discourse on justification after his discourse on sin in the epistle to the Romans - you will notice here that Paul says that justification is by grace (vs. 24), and you will see that Paul says that justification is through faith (vs. 22, 25, 26). The two are not opposed to each other or incompatible with each other or two different justifications.

Milne
Really, I don't know why this is so hard for you to comprehend. My answers to these questions aren't exactly new or novel or particularly insightful in some marvelous way. You could go to some place like monergism.com and read plenty of e...ssays on justification there, for example...

"Do you understand what it means when it is said that justification is an act of God's FREE grace?"

Yes. God chooses freely who he will justify. He justifies sinners who have no merit of their own. There is nothing we can do to merit or earn justification. By grace we believe, and by grace we are justified through faith... just as that Romans 3:21-26 passage makes abundantly clear repeatedly.

Do you understand that justification as an act of God's FREE grace is a DISTINCT and SEPARATE and independent act from that of the justified's act in receiving it?

No. That would be like saying that me handing something to somebody else is an independent act from that of the person receiving it. There is no gift without the receiving of the gift. Distinct? Yes, one is the act of God and the other is the act of man. Separate? Yes, one is the act of God and the other is the act of man. Independent? No, it is like the giving and receiving of a gift. Scripture says we are justified by faith. Justification is a free gift of God's grace, and faith is another free gift of God's grace - and remarkably, God works in an orderly manner, giving the gift of justification to the same people that he gives the gift of faith to - and we receive that justification by faith at the time that God gives it, as the aforementioned Scriptures say.

"When was Abraham justified by God's free grace?"
When God gave him the gift of faith.

"When did Abraham receive it by faith?"
When God gave him the gift of faith... Abraham was an unregenerate, unjustified, unbeliever in the land of Ur, then God spoke to him, regenerated him, gave him the gift of faith, and Abraham believed God and then obeyed. When he believed God, he was justified by God's free grace. After God called him effectually, he became a regenerate, justified, believer in God.

And unless any of the spectators on this status want more, I'm done


Sing F Lau
That's is where your fatal error lies: your understanding makes Abraham in Gen 12-15 an UN-justified man, i.e still under the condemnation of sin and death. And you are oblivious to this. You deserve a hard slap from Abraham when you meet him!

You are IGNORANT, and REFUSE of distinguishing forensic justification by God's free grace, and the evidential justification by the believing act of the child of God. The former is always logically AND chronologically PRIOR to the latter. They are two distinct aspect of justification!]

There is a justification that is by the FREE grace of God. In this justification, God deals with justly condemned sinners. This justification is NOT CONDITIONED on anything in those that needed to be justified, NOT EVEN their act of believing!

There is a justification that is CONDITIONED upon the believing act of God's children (only God's children can believe, only those who possess eternal life is able to believe).

That which is by God's FREE grace, and that which is CONDITIONED upon man's act of believing CAN'T POSSIBLY be the same. To insist that they are the same is plain confusion and pure obtuseness.

If you can't distinguish the two, I suggest to hold your peace.

If you insist so, then no profitable communication between us is possible. I don't want to waste my time.

Sing F Lau
Was Abraham a justified man by God's free grace before Gen 15:1-6?
Was Abraham justified by his faith before Gen 15:1-6?

Answer these, and learn the errors of your way.
Thanks.

Friday, December 24, 2010

Why preach the Gospel to every creature? A W Pink

Many actually despise the absolute Sovereignty of God in salvation.
It excludes them from any role in their eternal salvation.
They must limit it in some subtle ways!


From A. W. Pink's The Sovereignty of God, Chapter XI, pages 209-212 (Baker's original edition).
[But you won't find this in the severely truncated and edited edition published by the Banner of Truth. By our count 94 of 269 complete pages of the fourth (Baker) edition are missing and 241 of 525 paragraphs, not including missing words and sentences. The new school calvinists behind the BoT hate the old school teachings set forth by Pink in his book. Read the indictment against such deceit here.]

Why preach the Gospel to every creature?

Why preach the Gospel to every creature? If God the Father has predestined only a limited number to be saved, if God the Son died to effect the salvation of only those given to Him by the Father, and if God the Spirit is seeking to quicken none save God's elect, then what is the use of giving the gospel to the world at large, and where is the propriety of telling sinners that "Whosoever believeth in Christ shall not perish but have everlasting life"?

First; it is of great importance that we should be clear upon the nature of the Gospel itself. The Gospel is God's good news concerning Christ and not concerning sinners, - "Paul a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the Gospel of God.... concerning His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord" (Romans 1:1-3). God would have proclaimed far and wide the amazing fact that His own blessed Son "became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross." A universal testimony must be borne to the matchless worth of the person and work of Christ. Note the word "witness" in Matthew 24:14. The Gospel is God's "witness" unto the perfections of His Son. Mark the words of the apostle: "For we are unto God a sweet savor of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish" (2 Corinthians 2:15)!

Concerning the character and contents of the Gospel the utmost confusion prevails today. The Gospel is not an "offer" to be bandied around by evangelistic peddlers. The Gospel is no mere invitation, but a proclamation, a proclamation concerning Christ; true, whether men believe it or no. No man is asked to believe that Christ died for him in particular. The Gospel, in brief, is this: Christ died for sinners, you are a sinner, believe in Christ, and you shall be saved. In the Gospel, God simply announces the terms upon which men may be saved (namely, repentance and faith) and, indiscriminately, all are commanded to fulfill them.

Second; repentance and remission of sins are to be preached in the name of the Lord Jesus "unto all the nations" (Luke 24:47), because God's elect are "scattered abroad" (John 11:52) among all nations, and it is by the preaching and hearing of the Gospel that they are called out of the world. The Gospel is the means which God uses in the saving of His own chosen ones. By nature God's elect are children of wrath "even as others"; they are lost sinners needing a Savior, and apart from Christ there is no salvation for them. Hence, the Gospel must be believed by them before they can rejoice in the knowledge of sins forgiven. The Gospel is God's winnowing fan: it separates the chaff from the wheat, and gathers the latter into His garner.

Third; it is to be noted that God has other purposes in the preaching of the Gospel than the salvation of His own elect. The world exists for the elect's sake, yet others have the benefit of it. So the Word is preached for the elect's sake, yet others have the benefit of an external call. The sun shines, though blind men see it not. The rain falls upon rocky mountains and waste deserts, as well as on the fruitful valleys; so also, God suffers the Gospel to fall on the ears of the non-elect. The power of the Gospel is one of God's agencies for holding in check the wickedness of the world. Many who are never saved by it are reformed, their lusts are bridled, and they are restrained from becoming worse. Moreover, the preaching of the Gospel to the non-elect is made an admirable test of their characters. It exhibits the inveteracy of their sin: it demonstrates that their hearts are at enmity against God: it justifies the declaration of Christ that "men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil" (John 3:19).

Finally; it is sufficient for us to know that we are bidden to preach the Gospel to every creature. It is not for us to reason about the consistency between this and the fact that "few are chosen." It is for us to obey. It is a simple matter to ask questions relating to the ways of God which no finite mind can fully fathom. We, too, might turn and remind the objector that our Lord declared, "Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme. But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness" (Mark 3:28, 29), and there can be no doubt whatever but that certain of the Jews were guilty of this very sin (see Matthew 12:24 etc.), and hence their destruction was inevitable. Yet, notwithstanding, scarcely two months later, He commanded His disciples to preach the Gospel to every creature. When the objector can show us the consistency of these two things-the fact that certain of the Jews had committed the sin for which there is never forgiveness, and the fact that to them the Gospel was to be preached-we will undertake to furnish a more satisfactory solution than the one given above to the harmony between a universal proclamation of the Gospel and a limitation of its saving power to those only that God has predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son.

Once more, we say, it is not for us to reason about the Gospel; it is our business to preach it. When God ordered Abraham to offer up his son as a burnt-offering, he might have objected that this command was inconsistent with His promise "In Isaac shall thy seed be called." But instead of arguing he obeyed, and left God to harmonize His promise and His precept. Jeremiah might have argued that God had bade him do that which was altogether unreasonable when He said, "Therefore thou shalt speak all these words unto them; but they will not hearken to thee; thou shalt also call unto them; but they will not answer thee" (Jeremiah 7:27), but instead, the prophet obeyed. Ezekiel, too, might have complained that the Lord was asking of him a hard thing when He said, "Son of man, go, get thee unto the House of Israel, and speak with My words unto them. For thou art not sent to a people of a strange speech and of an hard language, but to the House of Israel; Not to many people of a strange speech and of a hard language, whose words thou cans't not understand. Surely, had I sent thee to them, they would have hearkened unto thee. But the House of Israel will not hearken unto thee; for they will not hearken unto Me; for all the House of Israel are impudent and hard hearted" (Ezekiel 3:4-7).

"But, O my soul, if truth so bright
Should dazzle and confound thy sight,
Yet still His written Word obey,
And wait the great decisive day."-Watts.

It has been well said, "The Gospel has lost none of its ancient power. It is, as much today as when it was first preached, 'the power of God unto salvation'. It needs no pity, no help, and no handmaid. It can overcome all obstacles, and break down all barriers. No human device need be tried to prepare the sinner to receive it, for if God has sent it no power can hinder it; and if He has not sent it, no power can make it effectual." (Dr. Bullinger).
==========

Pink Pinked

To our surprise we learned a number of years ago that the Banner of Truth Trust (hereafter referred to as the Banner), with which Mr. Murray has had the closest possible connections over many years, had done the same thing to Arthur Pink's important book The Sovereignty of God. At that time we were told that one chapter of Pink's book, a chapter entitled "The Sovereignty of God in Reprobation," had been removed in the Banner edition.

Not having a copy of the Banner edition we were unable to check the truth of what we had been told, and did not think much more of the matter. More recently, and for various reasons, we decided to investigate further, and were surprised by what we found.

The truth is that there are three whole chapters missing from the original edition of Pink's book. The chapter entitled "The Sovereignty of God in Reprobation" is missing, but so are two others, entitled "God's Sovereignty and Human Responsibility" and "Difficulties and Objections." Not only that, but four lengthy appendices (18 pages of the fourth edition as published by Baker Book House) are also missing from the Banner edition, appendices which are by no means unimportant. The titles alone will indicate to any discerning reader how important they are: "The Will of God," "The Case of Adam," "The Meaning of 'Kosmos' in John 3:16," and " I John 2:2."

What is more, large sections of other chapters are also missing - in many cases whole paragraphs, and in others sentences and words. By our count 94 of 269 complete pages of the fourth (Baker) edition are missing and 241 of 525 paragraphs, not including missing words and sentences. More than half of the book, therefore, is missing in the Banner edition, the only edition generally available to British readers.

The notices of this are found on the title page, where the Banner edition is referred to as a "Revised Edition," and in the publisher's preface which makes reference to "certain minor revisions and abridgements" (pp. 2-3). Whether this covers what the Banner has done to Pink's book, we leave to the reader to judge, especially in light of Mr. Murray's reference to the Kelvedon edition of Spurgeon's sermons as an "abridgement."

The only other reference we know of to this "revision" of The Sovereignty of God is found in Murray's biography of Pink, The Life of Arthur W. Pink, where he speaks of "the removal of some material" from the book. Again, we leave it to the reader to judge whether this constitutes "a warning … given to the reader."

Putting a church in remembrance of the truth



By God's grace, I was instrumental in gathering the Ipoh East church. The church was covenanted in Nov 2001. I ministered to the church for several years, and taught the church the gospel of grace. Towards the end of 2006, the church invited a Rev Keith from Sydney to minister for a month. After that I was informed that the church had decided to reject my pastoral oversight because of doctrinal differences. I respected their choice. The church had chosen to believe what the other RBs also believe... a summary of which can be seen here.

So we parted way. This letter was written to remind them of the gospel truth of justification by the free grace of God... i.e without faith, the believing act of man. Believing is EVIDENCE of justification by God's free grace. Instead, they along with the RBs insisted that their faith is the instrumental cause of their legal justification before God.

=========

February 2, 2007 11:31:41 PM GMT+07:00

Members of Ipoh East Church, and Brother T particularly,

You may wish to read a Circular Letter on Justification issued by the Philadelphia Baptist Association (with the 1689 BCoF as its doctrinal standard) - the first and the most influential Baptist Association of Particular Baptist churches in North America - to all its member churches in Oct 1785. The whole Letter is pasted below after my signature. It is also attached.

I quote a short and pertinent paragraph here:

"Third. Our justification is by some ascribed to faith as an instrumental cause. Strictly speaking, we apprehend faith as no cause at all in this momentous procedure, but rather AN EFFECT. It is true, the scriptures frequently mention a justification by faith. By such expressions it is evident the object, and not the act, of faith is designed; the object of faith is Christ and his righteousness; this the believing soul lays fast hold on. Faith is the eye which discovers, the hand which receives; espying a Saviour's worth, charmed with his merit, the believer is so enraptured as to cast away all his heavy burden, falls at Messiah's feet, confides in the promise, and pleads atoning blood: "With the heart man believeth unto righteousness," Rom. x. 10. It is beautifully noticed by one of our very first and most orthodox writers. "The reason why any are justified is not because they have faith; but the reason why they have faith is because they are justified." If justified faith as a work performed by us or a grace wrought within us; where would have been the necessity of the death and resurrection of Jesus? Faith is that precious grace, by which we do in a certain manner put on the righteousness of the Lord's anointed, and receive the greatest of all blessings from the God of our salvation. "It is grace (saith one) which quarrels much with human pride and make its only boast of Sharon's rose; and never was meant to be our justifying righteousness in the sight of God, else it would learn to boast." Faith says, "In the Lord have I righteousness;" and tells a sinner, "I cannot save thee; thou are saved by grace through faith." The grace of Jesus, and that alone brings salvation; and the sinner, through faith as an instrument, puts in his hand, is enabled to reach the rich donation; just as a beggar, by his empty cap stretched forth, receives an alms. We proceed,"
[red bold emphasis mine, sing]

May the Lord enlighten you what the Particular Baptist forefather DID ACTUALLY believe. Whether you agree with them or not is a separate matter.

The OLD SCHOOL Particular Baptists believed Forensic Justification BEFORE faith. Faith is an effect of forensic justification.
Their new school stepchildren believe Forensic Justification by their faith!
They OLD SCHOOL Particular Baptists believed ONLY the justified can exercise faith.
Their step-children believe one must have faith to be justified!
Benjamin Keach described such as 'woefully blind.'

By grace, I remain
your brother in Christ,
sing
---
Below is the Circular issued by the Philadelphia Baptist Association in 1785.

October 4th, 1785 JUSTIFICATION By Elder William Rogers

The ministers and messengers of the several Baptist churches, convened in Association, at Philadelphia, October 4, 1785.

To the respective churches, with whom we are connected, send Christian salutation.

Dearly beloved in our Lord Jesus Christ,
The subject, which we are to address you upon, is contained in Chapter IX, of our Confession of faith, which treats of Justification. A subject truly important! One of the fundamental articles of our holy religion! As such, demands our very particular attention. Therefore, wherein we are obliged, owing to the confined limits of our annual epistle, to study brevity, our hope and expectation is, that you will individually make up such deficiency by serious meditation.

Perspicuity being our aim, we shall,
I. Explain the term.
II. Consider the Author.
III. The objects interested.
IV. The blessings resulting.

The full article can be read here:
http://pruning-deformed-branches.blogspot.com/2008/01/justification-circular-letter-in-1785.html
=======

Date: April 20, 2007 12:46:54 PM GMT+07:00

Brethren of Ipoh East Church,
Since you are so hesitant to provide me the Church account number for me to revert the fund, I would just buy a bank cheque payable to 'Ipoh East Church' this coming Monday, and send it to Brother Larry's address. Someone would need to deposit the bank cheque at your end too! We can all save ourselves such hassles. Petrol is not any cheaper at the pump either... though I go about by motorbike in Penang.

"Yea, I think it meet, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir up by putting you in remembrance... that ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour."

"Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
The new birth from above that bestows eternal life is the absolute prerequisite to perceiving and believing the things of the Spirit of God. Spiritual things are spiritually discerned. Natural man, being dead in trespasses and sins, cannot see, much less receives the things of the Spirit of God. Eternal life MUST PRECEDE faith. Faith is certainly NOT a condition of eternal life, though it is certainly a condition to evidence eternal life.

"And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins."
Natural man, being spiritually dead in trespasses and sins, except he be quickened and given eternal life by the Spirit of Christ, cannot see the kingdom of God. A quickened man possesses eternal life because God has acquitted him of the condemnation of death by forgiving him all his sins, and by imputing to him the righteousness of Christ unto justification of life. The removal of the condemnation of death by the Father based solely on the righteousness of Christ alone logically precedes the bestowal of the eternal life by the Spirit of Christ.

"Whosoever believes HAS eternal life."
Eternal life is the effect of the new birth by the free and sovereign grace of God. Believing is a spiritual activity of the eternal life that has been bestowed by the free and sovereign grace of God. Believing manifests the presence and possession of that eternal life that has been bestowed freely by the sovereign grace of God when he was dead in trespasses and sins.

Since the Scriptures repeatedly declares 'whoever believes HAS eternal life' then whoever believes (present tense) is declared/justified/vindicated that he has been given (perfect tense), and does possess eternal life. Therefore whosoever believes in Christ has warrant to believe that has eternal life by the free and sovereign grace of God.

Believing is the condition/instrument to make manifest and demonstrate that the bestowal of eternal life be God's free and sovereign grace HAS taken place.

"The just shall live by faith."
Since, the Scriptures repeatedly declares, 'the just shall live by faith,' then whosoever lives (present tense) by faith declares and demonstrates that he has been justified (perfect tense) by the free grace of God. His faith justifies (present tense) evidentially that he has been justified legally by God free and sovereign grace. The justified ones, by God's free and sovereign grace, shall live by faith. Therefore whosoever lives by faith in Christ has warrant to believe that he has been justified by the free and sovereign grace of God.

Conditions to evidence
Believing is the condition/instrument to manifest and evident the justification and eternal life that God, by His free and sovereign grace alone through the righteousness of Christ, has accomplished all by Himself without the aid or cooperation of man.

And this faith comes by hearing, even the hearing the word of truth. The preaching of the word of truth draws forth the grace of faith worked in the heart by the indwelling Spirit. For that reason, 'preach the word, be instant in season, and out of season.'

They who insist that believing is the condition to be justified by God and in order to obtain eternal life are woefully blind to the gospel truth of their salvation. (Benjamin Keach)

putting you in remembrance of BASIC gospel truth,
sing
=======

[After rejecting my spiritual oversight over them they considered me erroneous, if not heretical, they insist continuing their monthly gift, which was previously intended for traveling allowance.]

On Apr 20, 2007, at 12:43 PM, wrote:

Hi Pastor Lau,

The silence is not avoidance! I've been swamped with things to do this first quarter- hopefully it will taper off back to baseline. We remember you and the church in Penang at our prayer meetings.

The money given is not issue with us. Although we disagree on some areas of doctrine, I do not see any issue with giving gifts as the Lord enable us. I see it this way:
1. If I can donate to my daughter's school building fund etc which enables them to teach evolution in school and other ungodly (who knows what else) ideas
2. If I can donate to the salvation army orphanage (which we do occasionally, in kind) that is probably doctrinally quite a distance from us
3. If we can consciously pay tax to the ruling islamic govt (although this one is req by scripture) for building mosques and supporting corruption
4. If we (in P..'s time) can support a missionary (arminian-ish) in part of russia. Surely we see you closer in fellowship that all the above four - (at least we do!!)

Will you not accept the monthly gift as coming from our hearts and not out of merely 'doing things in accordance to procedures'?

a Christian, a baptist, a reformed baptist (in that order)
T
=======

On Apr 21, 2007, at 11:34 PM, sing wrote:
Brother T...,

Thanks for your reply above. I do understand that the monthly support is not an issue with you... the way you see the issue in the 4 illustrations. I am actually very weary of the pragmatism - which hardly deal with the issue at hand biblically.

I have no use for 'doing things in accordance to procedures' or being political correct or being nice. However, I do wish that IEC as a Church should learn to conduct herself according to biblical principles, not pragmatism. I request you to be clear minded and appreciate the vast difference between what you as a generous, large-hearted and broad-minded individual may wish to do with your own money, and what a confessional church of Jesus Christ may do with her fund.

A church is duty bound to observe the biblical principles. A church of Jesus Christ has no liberty to support a man whose teaching the church has resolved as erroneous. Paul wrote to the church in Rome, "Mark them... avoid them." Romans 16:17. Read Eph 5:11, Titus 3:10, 2Jn 10, etc. If Ipoh East Church wish to observe what Christ has commanded, then Ipoh East Church has no liberty to support me. All I desire is that Ipoh East Church observes Christ's commandment and be consistent. For that reason I don't wish to be a party to this disobedience and misguided kindness.

Under the present situation, I won't receive the gift from Ipoh East Church. I have stated the principle and reason clear enough. It is not because of disrespect or ill-will toward anyone or IEC. I am only practicing what I teach. I do oppose from the pulpit the perverse and irrational error that "faith is a condition of justification and eternal life" - the same error that the Ipoh East Church has publicly RESOLVED to embrace. I would be a shameless hypocrite to receive support from a church that knowingly choose to embrace such irrational and perverse and anti-grace error.

And just because an Arminian is happy to receive support from some RB churches does not make it right for Sungai Dua Church to accept support from your church. I wouldn't appeal to P..'s bad example for my guidance. There was a sharp disagreement on that issue - I told him the principle: "We have the right, as individuals, to give away as much of our own money as we please in charity; but as members of Congress we have no right so to appropriate a dollar of the public money." ---Davy Crockett. Some men are more prone to money-based mission, it is alright (with me) if it is money from their own wallets, and not the church's coffer or the MSF's account! Why denounce the errors of the Arminians from the church pulpit and then get the church [sic] to support them at the same time. You see that as honorable and wonderful and loving. I see that as sheer hypocrisy and schizophrenic!

I am now convinced, after these few years of interaction with RBs worldwide, that the RBs are really CLOSER to the Arminians than they would admit... both the Arminians and the RBs insist that faith is the condition of justification and eternal life. After all, RBs were really Arminians in the 1960's, who began to reform their Arminian errors in order to return to their historical root - that's how recent the RB's origin was!

They never quite return to where their Particular Baptist forefathers were. But they are so sincere in believing that have returned to their root... and so proud of their 'Reformed' label. But they fall far short... and censure their forefathers as hyper!

Do remember that Ipoh East Church is confessionally a 1689 CoF church - whatever type of christian you personally wish to be known as.

Thanks for bearing with me. I am a man under authority, and I wish to keep a clear conscience.
I will send Brother Lee a bank cheque in the post on Monday.

with love and affection for Christ's sake,
sing

Monday, December 6, 2010

Handling the word of God deceitfully!

Just dismiss the issue by calling them names...

Mundy

I think the missionaries who use such techniques as you described are using enticements, cunning, and craftiness.

2 Cor 4:2 "But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God." (KJV)

Sing F Lau
Gospel regenerationists of both the Arminian and the Calvinist sorts, who believe that their labor is instrumental in the regeneration of those dead in trespasses and sin - do inevitably succumb to the great temptation to use all sort of enticements and gimmicks and psychological manipulation to get their hearers to make decision so that they may get 'regenerated' - so necessary for them to write their bogus SUCCESS stories.

Johnso
Sing: don't crash our party with your hyper-calvinist dreck.
I do agree, however, that Arminian decisional-regeneration beliefs may lead us to lower the bar of what constitutes success.

We are to be vigorous in our means, but make sure that our means are biblical.

As the Puritans wrote, "We are neither to be idle in our use of means, nor are we to make an idol out of the means."

Sing F Lau
Johnso, it seems tragic to me... that the inquiry whether the means was ordained for the conversion of God's children or the regeneration of those still dead in trespasses and sin is so conveniently dismissed and turned into a 'hyper-calvinist dreck'!

The issue is not about being idle with, or idolizing the means!

There is no option, but being active employing the means.

The issue is, what is the exact function or design or purpose of the means that has been ordained! It is important and needful to grasp the exact issue under consideration.

Are the means ordained for the CONVERSION of God's children, or for the REGENERATION of those STILL dead in trespasses and sins?

So according to your understanding, at least the Calvinists and the Arminians are agreed that the means is ordained as an instrument for regeneration.

In your understanding, those who believe that the means was ordained for the CONVERSION and INSTRUCTION of God's children (i.e those God already regenerated, immediately and directly, without the ministry of the gospel) are 'hyper-calvinists'?

Do I understand you correctly?

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I ruined the party of the Calvinsts; I was booted out!

Saturday, December 4, 2010

FEEDING SHEEP OR AMUSING GOATS?

FEEDING SHEEP

OR AMUSING GOATS

(C H Spurgeon)
John 21
15 ¶ So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.
16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.
17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

You read that! Christ ALREADY has His lambs and sheep by His gracious and sovereign activities. He sends His servants to feed them. He didn't send you to make them!

How many preachers so sincerely believe that their work consist of making some genuine offer of salvation to goats in order that they may be turned in lambs and sheep through their believing! Gospel regenerationitis is a virulent disease.

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FEEDING SHEEP OR AMUSING GOATS?
(C H Spurgeon)

The mission of amusement fails to effect the end desired.

An evil resides in the professed camp of the Lord so gross in its impudence that the most shortsighted can hardly fail to notice it. During the past few years it has developed at an abnormal rate evil for evil. It has worked like leaven until the whole lump ferments. The devil has seldom done a cleverer thing than hinting to the Church that part of their mission is to provide entertainment for the people, with a view to winning them. From speaking out as the Puritans did, the Church has gradually toned down her testimony, then winked at and excused the frivolities of the day. Then she tolerated them.

My first contention is that providing amusement for the people is nowhere spoken of in the Scriptures as a function of the Church. If it is a Christian work why did not Christ speak of it? "Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." That is clear enough. So it would have been if He has added, "and provide amusement for those who do not relish the gospel." No such words, however, are to be found. It did not seem to occur to Him. Then again, "He gave some apostles, some prophets, some pastors and teachers, for the work of the ministry." Where do entertainers come in? The Holy Spirit is silent concerning them. Were the prophets persecuted because they amused the people or because they refused? The concert has no martyr roll.

Again, providing amusement is in direct antagonism to the teaching and life of Christ and all His apostles. What was the attitude of the Church to the world? "Ye are the salt," not sugar candy - something the world will spit out, not swallow. Short and sharp was the utterance, "Let the dead bury their dead." He was in awful earnestness! Had Christ introduced more of the bright and pleasant elements into His mission, He would have been more popular when they went back, because of the searching nature of His teaching. I do not hear Him say, "Run after these people, Peter, and tell them we will have a different style of service tomorrow, something short and attractive with little preaching. We will have a pleasant evening for the people. Tell them they will be sure to enjoy it. Be quick, Peter, we must get the people somehow!" Jesus pitied sinners, sighed and wept over them, but never sought to amuse them. In vain will the Epistles be searched to find any trace of the gospel amusement. Their message is, "Come out, keep out, keep clean out!" Anything approaching fooling is conspicuous by its absence.

They had boundless confidence in the gospel and employed no other weapon. After Peter and John were locked up for preaching, the Church had a prayer meeting, but they did not pray, "Lord grant Thy servants that by a wise and discriminating use of innocent recreation we may show these people how happy we are." If they ceased not for preaching Christ, they had not time for arranging entertainments. Scattered by persecution, they went everywhere preaching the gospel. They "turned the world upside down." That is the difference! Lord, clear Church of all the rot and rubbish the devil has imposed on her and bring us back to apostolic methods.

Lastly, the mission of amusement fails to affect the end desired. It works havoc among young converts. Let the careless and scoffers, who thank God because the Church met them halfway, speak and testify. Let the heavy-laden who found peace through the concert not keep silent! Let the drunkard to whom the dramatic entertainment has been God's instrument in their conversion, stand up! There are none to answer. The mission of amusement produces no converts. The need of the hour for today's ministry is believing scholarship joined with earnest spirituality, the one springing from the other as fruit from the root. The need is biblical doctrine, so understood and felt, that it sets men on fire.


“For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish [the goats] foolishness; but unto us which are saved [the sheep] it is the power of God… and the wisdom of God… it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.”
Apostle Paul